But cheapo Challinor was a huge success which blows thar argument out of the water doesn't it?

Unfortunatley Challinor was a one off and that one off even came out in public and said what he was offered was derogratory, after we were promoted. Look were all our players and managers end up? Over the last 3 seasons or so only Challinor and dan kemp have beem any sort of success anywhere, im sure ive missed some but that is pathetic for a club that signs about 30 players a season and has about 3 managers a season.

But your argument was about bringing in proven managers - the reality is our most successful spells have been under the exact opposite, Alan Murray, Neale Cooper, Turner, Challinor for example.
One thing they had in common was belief in themselves and high demands of their players to play to their potential.

No they dont have to be proven what im saying is we are going down the cheap route every time, in the hope we find someone, we did with , Challinor but still raj managed to piss him off and we do it playing wise. When neal cooper came in he wasnt scrambling round the scarboroughs and halifax and derby under 13s for players, he was allowed to sign decent players.

Well let's see what Philips can find for next season. At least the millstones of Hastie, Lacey, Patterson, Ndjoli, Weah, and more should be gone.
Challinor was quite happy to take the job on the wage Raj was offering, he was also publicly happy after Raj upped his wage, ultimately he was lured away for a wage which we couldn't match (rumoured to have been about a 300% increase).
Challinor hadn't done a lot prior to coming to us and in fact was out of work having been sacked by well funded (at the time) Fylde if memory serves me right.

Lets hope they are a sight better than the loans he has turned too.

Same old same old nonsense.
Never get bored of it do you.
As you well know when Cooper was around we were owned by an oil company and had some money behind us.
It wasn't like that before....it isn't now... and won't be in the future.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OP6U5LBqA9A

Of course you are going to get the likes of Leicester winning the premier league once in a blue moon but in general money talks.

All of Stockport, Wrexham and Chesterfield spent big to get out of this division.

“Going down the cheap route” what about going down the route we can afford.

Would have loved to have been a fly on the wall in training up at Durham today.....oh wait they were probably all given the day off to rest up ...

So Gateshead are going great guns despite having a novice manager who left and was replaced by another novice manager, they have very low crowds and hardly 2 pennies to rub together.
Like it or not, we need to find a way to emulate them because the much called for sugar daddy isn't on the horizon. And thats the reality for probably 90% or more clubs in our league and div 2.

We need someone to spend big then….I see a problem, who…?
Sometimes it’s not about splashing the cash but getting the right manager with his people in and clear the decks, …….as we saw last night.
If Gateshead can do it, we can.

Gateshead had a rogue chairman not so long ago, they managed to get rid of him and regrouped and have made great progress since.

I'm not sure where I said we need to spend big, just pointing out that money tends to talk.

There's a reason why we have only finished in the top half of the league a couple of times since IOR's funds ceased.

"derby under 13s" - what, like Dejaune Brown, the 18-year-old Gateshead signed on a Youth Loan from Derby in January? The kid who is keeping the Heed's top scorer out of their team and grabbed another couple of goals last night?

You'd have gone your ends if Pools had signed him. It took 8 substitute appearances before he got his first goal - just imagine the fun you'd have had with that Signed a kid on a youth loan... a new low even for Raj, blah, blah, blah.

We don't need an oil company for it to be an improvement on Raj.

‘Group Expert’ my arse… on what,…..’Groups’…. I have a feeling about this one.

Billi P you didn’t say spend big you said we always take the cheap option so I say spend what you can afford.

Mystic Twaddle.

Spend wisely.

How many times have the same conversations taken place on this forum… at some point you’ve just got to laugh and think… there’s nowt you can do. Inherent and historic losers I’m afraid. We can analyse managers, players all we like. Been shite for time and until Raj does leave and something better comes along, get used to it. We love the club but my word, iconically bad that it’s brilliant!

For whatever reason, any good football manager or good footballer leaves us at the first chance of asking. That tells you all you need to know. Like I say, again, iconically bad that you have to say it’s brilliant

It’s like drowning, once you stop struggling, apparently it’s easier…..or so they tell us, but I’ll hang onto my piece of wreckage for the forseeable future.

It seems to me that you are having a go at fellow poolies If I am correct then why I think it's very fair to say everyone on here is pisssed off not just you and everyone wants things to drastically improve. I have seen lots of messages rightfully having a go but not seen one message saying these people are out of order for having a go. I have not seen a message yesterday or today saying the fans are wrong and the club is great etc. We all have opinions and won't always agree but at the end of the day we all want what's right for our club.

Gateshead and other tinpot clubs.
But let's lose this shit that IOR not running our club anymore = prolonged acceptable failure.
Some dogs hit excuses on here.

There’s no such thing as anyone wanting prolonged acceptable failure, it’s about reality…IOR was a small spell in the history of the club overall and I don’t recall our history being one of sparkling glory, far from it.
However, we live in hope, but the knight in shining armour hasn’t put in an appearance yet, but life goes on.

[quote="thebigdog"]How many times have the same conversations taken place on this forum… at some point you’ve just got to laugh and think… there’s nowt you can do. Inherent and historic losers I’m afraid. We can analyse managers, players all we like. Been shite for time and until Raj does leave and something better comes along, get used to it. We love the club but my word, iconically bad that it’s brilliant!

For whatever reason, any good football manager or good footballer leaves us at the first chance of asking. That tells you all you need to know. Like I say, again, iconically bad that you have to say it’s brilliant [/quote

Well I've been supporting this club for 72 years and for the best part of that time I have been aware that there is really nothing I can do to change anything and that applies to the vast hordes of Poolies over the years. The ideal situation is for a born and bred Poolie to have enough cash to get hold of the club and run it with the right balance between his heart and his head. That hasn't happened as yet and probably never will but the chance increased remotely with the advent of the euromillions and that is a hope that we can cling to.
Recently some fans have had a go at the way the club is being run and demanded more investment or get out. Relentless attacks on anything and everything in order to achieve improvement. Has any of that worked ? NO. Has our position improved? NO. Have they managed to get rid of the owner? NO.
Mr Bigdog says "until Raj leaves and something better comes along get used to it." However taking that stance to some people on here is classed as capitulation, a lack of ambition, Raj loving tendencies, resignation to mediocrity etc etc, when in actual fact is simple recognition of the fact that no matter what hopes, dreams or expectancies we crave for, the harsh reality is that we have to rely on someone else achieving that for us. Owners, managers, players etc.
People mention the good years under IOR. Yes they were good but the inevitability was always there that it would end some day and it did. They didn't give us those good years because they loved the club, the Town or the supporters, It suited THEM to do what they did and our joy was a mere by product. It was unique and will probably never be repeated. How many other owners have we had that come anywhere near them ??? Owners appear at other clubs from time to time and splash a bit of cash but how long does it last??? The big exception is Gibson at the Boro but he is a fan and that makes a big difference. His stewardship is closing in on forty years and I can safely say that I have never met a more whinging bunch of supporters in my life. When I was a kid and they had Cloughie at centre forward they were a second tier outfit and that is what they are now. Our level has mainly been bottom EFL tier with the odd sojourn higher which got more regular under IOR and nearly made the championship. Now we are one league below our regular spot and every single one of us is dying to get back to regular third tier football but the elusive catalyst to get us there is unfortunately missing and until that changes there is nothing we supporters can do, other than do what we are good at. That is the reality. As for defending RAJ, who does that. Personally my only defensive concern is defending the bunker and you it's members. Believe me nobody on this planet wants change more than me but, on here, I have a job to do and I do it to the best of my ability and therefore must keep my gob under control. It's not easy I can assure you.

Pools were never owned by an oil company, IOR were involved in the industry but had no assets as such. IOR employed around 20 people in an office in Aberdeen. They were in ‘partnership’ with Larsen Oil and Gas, when they with drew their backing, it was around this time that the owner Berge Larsen was convicted of tax fraud. Berge Larsen was convicted of defrauding his own company, Larsen Oil and Gas, and evading tax to protect his riches of around $108million, but later acquitted on appeal in 2016. IOR did not have the funds to continue to support Pools so had to sell them.

The early years were good years under IOR, personally I think we should have made more progress than we did as I never quite rated Turner, but that’s water under the bridge….we call Raj’s managerial willingness to pull the trigger, but we knew when the ‘happy years’ were over when Uncle Ken started sacking managers at a rate that makes Raj look like Mother Teresa in comparison, the years when we knew our owners were looking to dump the adopted orphan and get rid of Pools.
We thought it would last forever….but such generous benefactors are in it for the money or prestige….they all tire at this level eventually unless fans themselves.

Sums it up perfectly Derwent. One thing you missed though, we did have a local businessman who was from the town with some money and although we didn't win anything he did bring stability before announcing he couldn't take us any further - Harold Hornsey.

Singh isn’t in a position financially to take Pools to the level of IOR, the salaries there were paying was probably way in excess Singh can afford or wants to pay therefore Pools are looking at free transfers, loans and bring some of the youths through to the first team.
The best we can hope for is to survive this season hope Phillips comes good and manages to sign some decent players during close season.

I remember him being interviewed during the IOR takeover and describing how when he took over the club how he realised the enormity of the financial commitment and commented about just signing cheques and realised he didn’t have the financial clout to carry on to the level he wanted.

I remember Trigger signing from Mansfield and when asked why he signed he said because at the time Pools where the Chelsea of that division financially.

I remember that too, but theres a big difference in hoping for an improvement on the current regime vs hoping for another IOR.

Both are mirages, yet some people as in the film scenes crawl across the desert looking for the Oasis, that ain’t there.

I don't think the former is, the latter is of course pie in the sky.

Surely we're all on the same side and we're hoping for an improvement with the current regime, until something better comes along and changes the regime.

I don’t think anyone is demanding for another IOR (although 2 very successful actors were turned down by Raj who likely would’ve had the same effect), they’re looking for some sort of plan. We lurch from summer to summer signing 20+ players and churning through managers, while clubs like Gateshead, Altrincham, Halifax and Bromley outcompete us on smaller budgets due to them having some form of identity. This comes from the top and is something Raj seems incapable or unwilling to implement. I’m very well aware that me saying that I want Raj to leave on a forum will not bring about any change but I like many others am allowed to express my opinion.

For what it’s worth I want to see what happens on Friday……I want to see what these players are made of after Tuesday.
Pointless getting rid of the manager on the basis of this humiliation, is anyone so fragile they have to keep chopping and changing. Let’s see what Friday brings first.

Will he resign?
F/k no.
Don't underestimate Hartlepool.
Don't underestimate him.
KP is a fighter not a quitter.
Obvious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7p8hfaVz6E from 04.11

Agree, only the players can put things right or at least make a better fist of things tomorrow. Let's see who cares enough.

Just to put the Ryan Reynolds thing to bed, they did not make an offer at any point, when they assessed the potential clubs they were interested in we came a close 2nd to Wrexham. Wrexham pipped us due to their being no already sizeable clubs in the near vicinity whereas we have Boro, Sunderland, and Newcastle. This from the guy who was the Head of the assessment team, now COO at Wrexham.

So, one bid since the club was put up for sale shows how attractive we are as a purchase. I would presume Wrexham hadn't been inundated with offers too as they were very much in the doldrums when Holywood came knocking.

challinors cv was far better than the vast majority of managers we have had. he had multiply promotions at his previous clubs colwyn bay and fylde. thing was he had the money at both these clubs. he had something as well that all managers need a bit of luck. oates went from zero to hero under him and he hit lucky with armstrong. then the final could have gone either way and torquay were a finger tip from promotion. how would that season have panned out if oates had been out for the season and armstrong had been another fondop. possibly the only half a season the team and club actually did have a bit of luck on their side.

true, but it was still a gamble signing him just the same as the ones we sign. he would just as easy been a crap kid not up to it than coming good. possibly their style of play has helped him more than ours has for the kids we sign as there does not seem one.

While we are at it can we also put the £14 million from that socially conscious investor to bed.
The investor who conveniently put not one penny into the solicitors proof of funds account.
I wonder why?
According to those lovely girls and boys at HUST that was just because they arrived late to the party.
Yeah ...right


"One of our members is a major international investment company with impressive, socially conscious projects under development in the North East. They approached the consortium as they wanted to be part of a partnership that can help to drive the club and town forward and showed us proof of £14 million which was available for investment. After discussions, the investment company said that they were confident of the ability of the existing consortium members to drive our club forward and joined.At this stage the other members of the consortium had already deposited close to £600,000 in a solicitor’s account. This money has remained there throughout negotiations."
https://www.hufcsupporterstrust.org.uk/ ... nuary-2024

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTOB-tkekEM

Just like to point out the COO of Wrexham would never come out and say ‘Hartlepool were first choice but…’. That would never go down well with the fan base of a club they own. People who broke the interest (including Jeff Stelling who had a meeting with them) in Pools well before Wrexham even had an offer put in for them by Reynolds etc said that Hartlepool were first choice and at least 1 offer was made.
Either way it doesn’t matter as it didn’t happen, I was merely using it as a point to show that some rich individuals do take an interest us

Not advocating a change in manager at all Snowy. Merely wanting our club to build some sort of foundations for future success

You're right he wouldn't say we were first choice because we never were. His account was published in one of the national newspapers and he actually stated what the scores for the clubs were. Why would he have any reason to lie? What do you think the Wrexham fans would do if it was announced he'd they were second choice, boycott en masses or say like most sane people would "well we got lucky there didn't we"?

I'd take his version of events over anyone else's given he was the man who was at the head of the project.

If IOR had said they bid for Darlo but they tur Ed the offer down so they took us instead would we have driven them out of town?

Phillips said on Tees today the players were not fit enough, he was appointed mid January, why has it taken him this long to realise that ?

didn,t seem to be an issue though when we were winning and drawing games unless its mental and physical fitness he,s on about.

Maybe he was referring to their fitness to wear the shirt.

Pools need someone who knows how to run a club our size - when was the last time we actually had someone in the driving seat making all the right decisions to not just help us on on the recruitment front etc but also financially. we have all said many times the club could do more in XYZ and could make money by doing this an that...
Raj is a business man but he didnt make his money by been successful with football clubs, like we have all said before this is new ground to him still tbh and unless he has the right people around him who know how to run a club our size then hes pissing in the wind everytime. I could walk in with a few million but i damn sure would probs spunk it all on the wrong things etc.. its about knowing how football 'the business' works as well as the playing. This is what i think is a fundamental problem with Pools aswell. We need a good COO aswell as the staff below them with experience. Club Secretary - Accounts manager - contracts managers etc etc... All of these off field issues need to be bang on for a club to be a success no matter how much the benefactor has !