Are they being orchestrated???
If so who by??
Could it be the Labour party???
I have a hunch that they are being orchestrated and are a deliberate ploy to bring the government down, get an early General Election whilst the Labour party are well ahead in the polls and get them elected.
If it does happen like that the first thing that will happen subsequently is the Unions will say "right we've got you elected and now it's pay back time". Then the proverbial will well and truly hit the fan. The new Government will face a huge barrage of demands which they will be unable to meet.
Then what ?????

Not another 'hunch' surely? If in doubt, make it up!

That's how it looks Mr F and I'm not the only one with the same hunch.
The Labour party are very quiet on the subject.
We'll see how it pans out eh.

So you don't buy the argument that public sector workers are on their knees because after a decade of wage restraint their real incomes have fallen to the point where they can't cope with price inflation over 10%? Nurses needing to use food banks to get by? Not to mention the porters, cleaners and other low paid staff who are also essential to keeping the NHS just about standing? I'll admit to a bit less sympathy for the train drivers, who have always used industrial action to keep ahead of the game.

Negotiation is the only answer. The majority of these strikes can't be 'broken' because unlike the 1984 Miner's Strike, the country really can't do without the essential services the strikers provide.

The strikes are not being orchestrated by the Labour Party, the electorate have had enough, rising energy costs, inflation, rising interest rates mostly caused by the Truss disastrous period. How can you expect people to except rises of around 4%, yes you can’t expect a rise in line with inflation so there has be an in between solution. Currently the government are not really putting in any effort to negotiate, they are trying to turn the public against the strikers and threatening to introduce new laws to make it illegal to go on strike. We can blame Covid the Ukraine war but prior to that the Tory government had been in power and can anyone say what the benefits were ?
I have said it before I don’t want a G.E. let the current government fix it but judging by the number of Tories not standing at the next election their own don’t appear to have much faith in them.

If only governments were honest and said to fund the 10% increases for nurses, social care and teachers etc was going to cost us (for instance) 1p in the pound on income tax (or 3% on our council tax) then we would know that is the cost for good services.

Just saying "there's no money" doesn't help anyone. The only money the government has is our money so let's be honest about the cost of good nurses, teachers and social carers.

As for those people working on "public" transport, let the companies prove what the downside is on their profits before we say they can't afford it either. Network Rail profits dropped from £1.6bn to £300m apparently and that £300m will supposedly be swallowed up by the increasing costs of energy so that again comes down to the government, let us fund a public transport system to be proud of or don't

People have been pushed too far and are reacting. Ordinary people in the UK dont go out on strike for no reason and lose money especially on the run up to Christmas.

Funny how most strikers are in safe job public sector jobs, who in reality won’t be sacked …..private sector don’t have that option.

So who are they being orchestrated by? You, by your adamant statement that they are not being orchestrated by Labour is impressive, so can you impress us even more by telling us why you are so sure and divulging who actually is orchestrating them.

Now call me a cynic, but if you actually believe these disputes aren’t being orchestrated by someone, you believe in unicorns and fairy dust.
It’s back to the 70’s.

Absolutely Snowy, we've seen it all before.

Well said Mr J..and we all know the opposition hasn't got a f clue..

When you say you are a floating voter, you do realise you're floating somewhere between the Tories and Reform UK?

Labour are almost as tory as the tories which is desperately sad. Not one working class person should vote tory because they will do literally fuck all for you and yet many, many do. The tories laugh like fuck at the working classes bickering amongst themselves as their lies and propoganda brainwash those people who choose to read and believe the controlled media. The BBC is an absolute joke, just look at any BBC interview with Mick Lynch - unbelievable bias. The newspapers are just ridiculous yet people still believe the shite they peddle.

Some of the comments on here are staggering but I aren't surprised just extremely sad and genuinely concerned for where all this is heading.

If the current government are left in, we're royally fucked. If a general election is held and Labour get in I think it would be marginally better but I mean marginally. Just look how Labour treated its own people when they openly supported the strikes. And that's the fucking Labour party who are supposed to have working people's interests at heart. Not any more.

Just wait and see what laws are going to be passed very soon. Striking will be impossible. The government will skint the unions by insisting they put every tabled offer to a ballot. The unions don't have the money to continually ballot members. The offers will, of course, be utterly terrible.

And for the record, I work for the railway and the offer made was desperately bad and no, I don't give a fuck about the money, it's the changes they are looking to implement. Nobody would agree to them. One of which was the goverment proposing that all trains become driver only - that's everywhere, throughout the country and by the way it was the government who put that in as part of the proposal and was nothing to do with the Rail Delivery Group (who for those who don't know are the ones negotiating with the unions).

Would you feel safe on a train with no guard travelling late any night? Just imagine how vulnerable groups of people would feel. What happens when things go wrong? Who you going to speak with? The driver? I don't think so, he's got more than enough to do driving the train.

What happens if the driver carks it? Train will grind to a halt and there you are, middle of nowhere with no one knowing what the fuck to do. It would be chaos and extremely dangerous.

The semi-recent accident at Stonehaven (landslide) where 3 people died included both the driver and the guard but it was an off duty guard who raised the alarm. No guards and there would've been no one to report it - that is one example off the top of my head.

It's always the same. The working classes are put on again and again and fed a load of bollocks to keep us in line, the fact some go along with it is the reason why we're fucked. Divide and conquer and the working classes are very divided. Just providing we can all go get pissed up on a weekend and watch Pools get spanked very week then we're living free and happy lives.

Just consider this, why do our elected government see the problems the country is having with widespread dissatifaction about the health service, policing, housing, the environment, standards or living and wages as a fucking battle to be won?? Why are they not fucking listening and trying to solve the root cause of the issues for the benefit of all and actually helping people? Well, it's because to do so would undermine the very people making their lives all lovely and rosey. They couldn't give a fucking monkey's about any of us and yet here we are STILL bickering amongst ourselves whilst those in power crack on with lining their own pockets and increasing their own power, reducing our rights and implementing more control.

1984 here we come.

No it’s not back to the 70s the unions then did want to bring the Tory government down, this about trying to get a decent pay rise in-line some where near the rise in the cost of living.

No, that’s how you perceive it and when you carry preconceived notions it’s hard to see the full picture. I’ve been an awkward squad shop Steward who even challenged my union for for colluding with employers when it suited them and in several places and been shunted out for my efforts. I’ve always voted Labour, even for Blair who was the one who woke me up to the degradation of the Labour Party to a middle class country club.
Actually I care for those who have no power to get a rise in the private sector, and despair that people think a £54k a year train driver is struggling financially. If some poor sod does the same for a private employer they’d be out on their arse as I’ve found out with a case I took a very active interest in over the past year.. and discovered the system is not on their side, but then it never was.
So don’t give me any nonsense about my politics as now it’s the territory of the fantasists and gobshites in every party.

For your general information..the Tory’s are a mess, a bag full of cats tearing each other apart and never mention Reform UK to me as they’re just a nuisance Party of pub populists who will never be anything but be very scared if they do ever come to power..I would be.
I’m a floating voter now, not someone marinaded in my ancestors voting habits to the point of not being able to decide for myself who gets my vote and not because because of allegiance to some self perceived class as I don’t believe in class,…. No one is my better and no one is below me.

Now, can we avoid relegation?

getting ever closer to the winter of discontent that brought down jim callaghans labour government and brought in years of tory rule. the opposite could happen again with years under labour again. like all strikes some get more public sympathy than others. just wonfer if the NHS clappers would be prepared to pay more tax to give them what they expected post covid.

I'd just like to add something to the driver wage debate - nobody has said drivers are underpaid, as I said earlier, this is not just about money (and certainly isn't the main issue for me personally) - have you thought it's actually the rest of society that's underpaid? Years and years of little/no pay rises that we've all sat back and allowed to happen, now the shit is hitting the fan because people are, at last, realising just how shite a deal they've got.

You shouldn't be going after the drivers, you should be supporting the drivers/guards/signallers/booking office staff as well as every other underpaid member of the working classes who are fighting for their wage and conditions of employment.

Nurses used to be quite well paid - they aren't anymore. Years of neglect has seen to that. And years of tories cutting services and funding, that's why the country is so fucked. It's being bled dry of the money it takes by the rich (who the tories are the puppets of) and all the while working and living conditions are being eroded.

The only reason the NHS is still going is because the people who work there, in the main, genuinely give a fuck and have an inbuilt desire to help and are working themselves into the ground - my missus works for the NHS and her first thought when asked about striking wasn't 'yeah, we need to walk out and get a decent living wage' it was 'I don't know if I can just walk out and leave those people' and that's what the government play on.

The NHS, as well as a lot of services, are being run into the ground by the tories and don't start with the 'we're paying billions in and are paying in the most any government ever has' bollocks because 1) it's nowhere near enough and 2) you've cut jobs with a fucking scythe and brought the health service to its knees.

The country hasn't moved with the times which is what the fuckwits we voted in are meant to be doing - they've been chosen (?!) to run the country and are fucking it up royally but to make matters worse, they see desenting people as the enemy and a battle to win?!?! What the fuck? It's madness. In football terms they'd have been long gone years ago.

Well said on both of your posts Shilts.

Well said Shilts.

It's the TUC whispering in all of their various unions ears and TUC are essentially the far left's mouthpiece. Much like the miners in 84, they are all asking for things that they know are impossible. 17% pay rises and the like. Let them strike, fuck 'em. Let them all live on strike pay and starve.

I was wondering when our very own Mr Blue would wade in and here we have it.

And wow, our views could not be much wider apart.

The government shouldn't even be involved in the discussions with the railway, that's the job of the RDG (Rail Delivery Group) and the TOCs (Train Operating Companies).

Funny how all those services run outside England have come to an agreement yet here we are in England with no agreement because the government have stuck their fucking noses in and scuppering any chance of a resolution.

They are, of course, not interested in a resolution. They want to 'win the fight'...but it shouldn't be a bloody fight!! There is no fight, only the one the government is creating.

No idea where you've got any numbers from re: pay rises. I'm a member of the RMT and work for the railway. There have been zero mention of numbers.

I accept your right to have differing views and would actively promote that but this...

'Let them strike, fuck 'em. Let them all live on strike pay and starve.'

...is pretty fucking dire.

By the way, here is a list of the conditions which came with the 4% now and 4% in 2023 pay offer....would you accept these? You can probably stop reading after number one!!

1. That all Workforce Changes are accepted without reservation or industrial action;

2. Closure of all ticket offices and displacement of all retail staff;

3. Creation of a new multi-skilled station grades;

4. A mass job severance programme;

5. Driver-Only Operation of trains in all companies and on all passenger services;

6. New arrangements for mandatory Sunday working;

7. A review of all On-Train Catering services leading to cutbacks in provision and jobs;

8. Review of Fleet grades' working practices and depot driving;

9. Flexible working contracts, working and rosters;

10. Mandatory adoption of new technology with no payment;

11. New Attendance Management scheme;

12. Review of Stood Off arrangements;

13. New annual leave and sick pay arrangements.

Forgot to add Mr I in response to this: '...they are all asking for things that they know are impossible...'

I don't believe that for one second.

They don't want to pay it. Their aim is control and power not equality.

It is a shame you've bought into, what I believe is, all their shite, I hope it doesn't bite you on the arse in future years. When it comes to the crunch they will not look after you.

Unless you're a banker. The people who caused the 2008 financial crash getting their regulations cut, whilst the working man is being restricted to withhold their labour while fighting for better pay and working conditions.

They possibly know they are not going to get that figure, but if they,d have asked for 10 per cent with no strings they,d be offered half of that if they were lucky. First thing on the news this morning was not the strikes but bloody meghan and harry,s net fllicks farce which shows what many are interested in.

Hope so!

'....which shows what many are interested in...'

Or looking at it a different way, what the editor wants you to see/focus on

Happens all the time, something major comes out that stuns the masses and there's outrage.....then the rage passes and whatever the issue was quickly becomes the accepted norm.

By the time the next election arrives everyone will've forgotten everything that makes the tories a fucking nightmare because the media they control will go into overdrive to project the tories in a positive light and batter the opposition....and there we have it, despite all the discontent they'll get back in, deliver fuck all for the umpteenth time and continue the destruction of the country for the benefit of the very, very few.

accepting 10 points out of the next 18 available would help.

The strikes are being orchestrated by the workers, they want a pay rise and they only way is through the unions, fortunately they have the protection of a union the workers were balloted on strike action, the unions didn’t tell them to go on strike, it’s not as if the pay rises are not justified. I can’t believe some of the comments, the unions are putting the workers up to it, in my day on the sites the disputes started on the sites and the union were brought in to resolve them.
What the rail unions are looking for is package to cover for the redundancies when ticket offices etc close, what other weapon does the working man have which has been eroded by the Tory government over years and they are trying erode even more.
I believe too many on here read the right wing press and watch tv programmes like the far right GB News
Shilts is right with all his comments, Neil 5005, bankers walked away scot free some even maintaining their pensions when they bankrupted the country in 2008 costing billions, it was criminal what the bankers done gambling with peoples life savings. Remember the queues outside Northern Rock people withdrawing their savings.
A few weeks ago Truss and Kwarteng crashed the economy forcing up interest rates crashing peoples investments including mine again walked away scot free.
Fast forward to the corrupt purchase of PPE involving friends of friends who had never manufactured PPE before. Some is being stored costing millions some has been used to fuel power stations.
Some of the posters on here need to get real and forget this is not the 70s we are living in, people are only asking for an increase in salary to match inflation not bring the government down.
We never had food banks in the 70s, it’s unbelievable the country with the 6th biggest economy have people relying on food banks.
My biggest concern is the Tories could call a G.E. washing their hands of all the current problems they have created leaving the Labour Party or who ever to pick up the pieces.

Correct along came Covid unfortunately and now the Ukraine war which has covered up all the problems brexit has caused. There is a video on YouTube made by journalists from The Times a far right wing newspaper citing all the issues brexit has caused instigated by people like Farage and Johnson just to win a G.E,

Thanks Shilts for putting the facts about the dispute on here. Strange how you never see these on the TV or in the papers.
I find that when you work or have worked in one of these affected industries (rail, NHS, Postal etc etc) you get then to see the facts and then you look to the media and all you see is a distortion which if believed would lead you to incorrect conclusions.

The U.K. is controlled by the right wing media newspaper owners and tv channels and people believe every thing they read or see.

And having said all that, you still want to keep the Tories in power.

One minute you are lambasting people on here accusing them of taking too much notice of the right wing press and here you are quoting them.
You couldn't make it up.

Because I quote them doesn’t mean I support them, no idea where you are coming from not unless you are on a wind up.

No worries, hope it helps.

I had the same conversation with a pasenger the other day and they agreed it was shocking that all the media will tell you is 'greedy drivers', 'greedy railwaymen'.

Those are the facts that I have, they're not my view, that was the actual proposal.

As I said earlier, you'd say 'no thanks' after reading the first on the list!

like many strikes in recent years its not all about money its giving away working conditions as well which have been gained over the years. once these are gone they are gone for life. even in the present conditions money is not everything and dreading going to work for it is as big an issue. worked for the highest paid bus company outside of london but not many enjoyed rolling up every day to receive it.

I worked in the NHS at one time and it was that that finally convinced me that the press peddle distortions rather than outright lies.
But privatisation by stealth is this governments agenda.

I am not sure how many people are aware but GP Practices are not run by the NHS albeit they fund them, they are run as a separate entity, a company from the States has been buying some of them up. The Practice receives a fixed amount per patient plus a payment for any procedure carried out.
They were talking about a separate panel, if the a Doctor referred you to specialist the panel would decide if it was necessary, not sure if it was ever instigated.

You make an interesting point on privatisation of the NHS. I was listening to a discussion on that recently in which the point was made that the NHS was too unwieldy and that already it was being muted that the private sector was being requested to take over some of the work load.
It does appear to be falling to bits, or that's what we are being told. I don't know what the answers are but it appears that there is a massive shortfall of finances required to fulfil the desires regarding where the service should be.
An ageing population is presenting it's own problems with the increased burden that places on the NHS and the care sector.
Maybe some extreme radical thinking needs to be encouraged but are we willing to pay for what appears to be required.

the NHS is regarded by many as a sacred cow that should never be criticised in any way. like all bationalised industries their main problem has always been the amount of asmin staff they seem to employ. some head of diversity would equal 4 nurses or more and thats just a starter. the thing is its not free as we are paying for it through taxes. would not mind paying an insurance policy for health care as long as its not a fiddle like per insurance is. those who live on the continent seem happy with their lot but those in favour of the present situation always dig up the worst scenario they can.

Having worked in the private sector all my life there is a huge difference to working in the public sector the main one no one is ever held accountable or very rarely gets sacked moved to the side maybe if anything goes wrong and it’s just swept under the carpet. You don’t perform in the private sector no matter what you do or your position is you can find it difficult to secure employment

been at one firm who went from the public to private sector and can agree with all that. plus the dead wood of non money earning staff slowly but surely were got rid of and never replaced. it was once said if you wanted a steady job and high pay was the least of your interests then the private sector was for you. If you were a go getter chasing the cash join the private one.

Railtrack is state owned. Virtually all of the Train Operating companies (TOCs)make big losses that are financed by state bail outs and the rest are run by the Operator of Last Resort (OLR) (state owned).
This means that every day there is a strike ticket revenue is lost offset slightly by strikers pay being reduced. The government finances this. Does anyone know how much this is?
The dispute is not all about pay but T&Cs and working practices but to know this figure would shed light on whether the governments & unions stance is political or economic.

According to our postman, Thw ROYAL Mail are trying to ditch letter delivery in favour of parcels.
With posties working till 6pm cover letter delivery.

no, but they pick em up late afternoon though. do think the parcels trade is one of their weekest line as you know when you are out they take the things back to the sorting office for you to get intouch for the delivery again or kust pick it up in person. at least with the other companies they leave it somewhere or with a neighbour which isn,t ideal but less of a bind.

Don’t the Royal Mail have a monopoly on letter delivery…?

EVRI have the monopoly of lost parcels.

Be nice if somebody owned up to watching these shows and reading the propaganda eh. Is there a leftie alternative you could suggest?