I wonder now if some people with their reactions display a shocking sign of immaturity in their reaction to events at matches. I can think of no other scenario where grown men will rant, rave and swear in front of family groups and think nothing of it.
I’ve been going a long time and don’t get me wrong, the swearing’s always been there on the terraces, but not with the bile and venom that seems to accompany abuse nowadays.
If people are racists in their everyday life, attending a match ain’t going to change their behaviour, the question is, how do you actually start on the process of eliminating it?

That's for people like the FA and charities like KickItOut to find out. The more I look back on yesterday, the incident we had wasn't even that isolated. Countless incidents of racial abuse all over the pyramid this season already, it's not even 2020 yet. The FA need to tackle the problem head on, that's for sure because it's spreading like a cancer.

First thing is giving every incident of this nature a permanent ban and not a few year slap on the wrist.

Secondly, I forgot what film I heard it in, but evil is not born, it is taught. Starts with the parents educating kids that this behavior is out of order.

about time we just mention this player or that and never mention his colour black, white, brown or whatever. colour should never come into it just the same as their place of birth or family history. being of polish decent i do know what i,m talking about although some think otherwise.

The problem a lot of the time it’s parents indulging in this behavior. I’m not sure what sort of age the racist buffoon was yesterday but the bloke on the pitch looked in his 50’s. I remember the bloke at Chelsea last season doing the same as happened yesterday to Raheem Sterling was that age as well.

It’s true people walk into football grounds and behave like they would nowhere else, I don’t know if it’s a release or a platform to let out some anger or pent up frustration. Everyone likes an atmosphere at football but sometimes it’s worth remembering that it’s only a game and in the grand scheme of things doesn’t really matter.

Abuse towards players and officials at football matches takes place all over the World and always has done and probably always will. How we put a stop to it is anybody's guess because there is not enough will to do that.
Racist abuse is usually defined by reference to a player's colour etc but how many coloured referees do we have in this country????? We have plenty of coloured players but very few coloured officials and yet the officials get just as much abuse, if not more, than the players. So is the abuse actually racist motivated or is it that it is an in built part of football. An unwelcome part of football but nevertheless still there.
Then we come to racism itself. All racism is abuse but is all abuse necessary racism????
The only time I have actually been called racist to my face was when I came to the rescue of an elderly person who was being abused by a black fella after a disagreement at a petrol station. I confronted this guy and stopped the abuse and was called racist because, as he accused me. I only intervened because he was black. I was very careful to choose my words to avoid that scenario and thankfully eye witnesses to the event backed me up.
Some of the worst abuse of officials and players I have heard is at school or junior football when parents let loose, especially mums!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I think a lot more thought and commitment has to go into this problem.

Here they come normalising racist behaviour

No, everyone has a responsibility. As long as we pass it off as someone else's job to do something about it we don't stand a chance of eradicating it.

What exactly can people do is the question. Most will have smartphones so can record evidence to pass on to the club and police.

I thought we were further ahead of countries like Italy in getting rid of racism in football. Evidently we're not and I still can't get over that it happened at Pools.

Who is normalising racist behaviour????
What people are actually trying to do is stop it from becoming normal and we collectively have to have the will and commitment to do that but we have to approach it in the right manner.
Your comment only serves to antagonise the very people you are trying to convert.
Some people deserve to be tagged as racist and some people don't.
We need to identify the element that need educating in order to stop them and that job is hard enough as it is without making it harder.

A more direct comment on this thread with regard to control could possibly be summed up by saying,
The referee lost control.
The man who ran on the pitch lost control.
The fans who resorted to racial abuse lost control.
Ryan Donaldson lost control.
Nicky Featherstone lost control.
Craig Hignett lost control.
Mark Simpson lost control.
The Stewards have been accused of not having any control to lose.
You could never describe it as just another run of the mill fixture.
Before any of the above criticise any other they need to have a good look at themselves.

They will all say that they didn't wake up on Saturday morning intending to lose control or behave like they did but that is exactly what they did do.

5 of them lost control because of 1 man.

That's interesting Mr Tree.
The next question is who will get the most blame and biggest punishments?
I dare wager it won't be the man to whom you refer.

That's interesting Mr Tree.
The next question is who will get the most blame and biggest punishments?
I dare wager it won't be the man to whom you refer.[/quote]

He will probably get promoted.

Derwent: In your post you refer to "coloured referees" and "coloured players", the term "coloured" is itself regarded as a highly offensive racial slur which recalls a time in the UK when casual racism was a part of everyday life. In the US it is among the most offensive words for describing a black person. The charity "Show Racism the Red Card" says "coloured
was used to describe anybody who was not white, which may imply that to be white is 'normal' or default,"
I understand and support the gist of your post, but we do have to be careful about the use of possible inflammatory language.

Good point Mr Ville, knowing Derwent he won't have meant it with any malice.

I understand where you are coming from Mr Ville but I can assure you, and anybody else that those descriptions were normal to the times in which we were brought up. The West Indians, Asians, Africans etc were referred to as "coloureds" but not for any malicious reason. Just as Americans were called Yanks, the Scots were Jocks, the Welsh were Taffies, the Irish were Paddies, the French were Frogs, the Chinese were Chinks, the Spanish were Diegos, the Germans were Krauts and so on.
We were brought up on pounds shillings and pence, feet and inches, miles per hour, gallons of petrol etc etc etc. We bought pounds of fruit and pounds of sausages etc etc. The list was endless. Then suddenly we were asked to ditch all that and change the way we described things. It is not easy. Maybe people should cut us a bit of slack.
I have sponsored young Africans to a better education that he or she would normally get.
I have given my time and hard earned cash to promote the creation of fresh water wells in Africa.
I have helped raise money to give eye camps to people in Africa that would otherwise go blind.
I don't need education on Racism or how to help our "coloured " brothers and sisters. I have been doing it all my life.
I don't object to be called white because that's what I am but I do object to being criticised by people who will never match the effort I have put in to helping people who are less fortunate than me.
All I ask is that people stop and think before they produce the racist card, because when that card is used it has to be used with one hundred per cent honesty because anything else simply waters down it's impact.
Think about it.

Yes acceptable at the time you were brought up 60 years ago times change and you should take time to learn what is and isn't acceptable otherwise you will look a thick bigot on the internet.

Racist card? are you suggesting this wasn't a case of racism? you are embarrassing, coz you bunged Live Aid a score doesn't mean you are immune from criticism

Think about it

DERWENT:
I take my hat off to you for what you have done over the years to help the African children who are born into poverty and are merely existing not living.

How anyone can reply to your post with critism is totally beyond me. .

Anyway that's me done with this place and social media. To many wankers thinking there hard as fuck who wudent say boo to ya in the street.
Fuck off in advance to the few Bellends on here who will glad to see the back off me.

UTP.
Poolie till I die.

I’m not sure threads like this are doing much good to honest and bringing up what perceived acceptable years ago.

What happened on Saturday other than condemnation doesn’t really require much discussion, whatever year whatever context it’s disgusting, vile, racism. Thankfully we’re in an era and part of the World (unlike in Italy a few weeks ago to Lukaku) when it was one complete and utter imbecile making the noise and gestures not half the ground but it’s still one too many and it really knocks your end in when it’s happened at our club. I’m fairly sure nobody means any malice or is in any way actual racist themselves in these discussions but they aren’t helpful at this time. I see no grey areas regarding what happened on Saturday it was a disgrace.

We clearly have an element of low life idiots, we have to accept that and find a way to make sure HUFC’s name isn’t disgraced by this type of simpleton again I think everyone involved in the club has a responsibility in working towards that including on message boards and other social media. It hurts and sickens me as a Pool fans that our club is being branded racist.

Didn’t I lock this thread ?


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Whilst your points are valid

It’s not right to say coloureds these days, you have to accept times change. Even if you don’t.


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60 years old the bloke arrested according to the Mail, about from the age range I’d expected it to be.

Check it out the message dropped off at the training ground this morning from a fans though, I’d safely say that the person who did that speaks for all of us not the idiot who’s watched his last Pools game.

Huh? Happy for you that someone else's gross display of prejudice gives you an opportunity to parade one of your own.

Not really, racism in football was particularly prevalent in the 70’s and 80’s especially. When I first started going in the late eighties racism at Pools and everywhere was very common. Things that we saw at the weekend and worse were a regular occurrence. A lot of the people indulging in that sort of thing then would be in that sort of age bracket now. A lot of EDL/National Front hooligan types aren’t kids they are in that age bracket as leftovers from that era of football. That bloke at Chelsea last who abused Raheem Sterling was. So the age of the person making the gesture doesn’t surprise me.

So there are no young racists in Hartlepool? Phew! That's a relief.

I’m not sure I said that or why you are being such a smart arse.

The gesture involved in the incident is the throwback to a certain era when it was common, so the age of the person involved doesn’t surprise me I don’t think I am out of order in saying this but take offence if you wish.

The bloke who mafuta went after looked about 40 how ever what difference does age make if your a racist.

It makes no difference but not that long ago racism in football grounds happened all the time and you obviously have people from that time who were in grounds indulging in this sort of mindless behavior still watching football now and if the right buttons are pushed these views are still there under the surface. I am not discriminating against anyone’s age a racist is a racist.

[quote="PJPoolie"] and if I be right buttons are pushed these views are still there under the surface.
that comment is spot on. it isn,t just at football either. doubt many have much time for the likes of tommy robinson but the main fear to racial harmony in this country is not him. if someone new comes along who has a more respectable air about them and not have a few nightclub bouncer types around him then the trouble could really start. a new oswald mosley, enoch powell and maybe nigal farage {if he came out of the closet} would gain followers in serious numbers.

So you think people of my age are racist, why because we are in our sixties.

So you think people of my age are racist, why because we are in our sixties.

He wasnt 60, that was the pitch invader

He was 43

Just to add he has been released under investigation

Pitch invader reported for summons

That has to be the bloke who went on the pitch not the racist, the lad who Mafuta was challenging looked to be in his 40's and worse still from where i was stood he looked to have just walked out of the ground unchallenged once he got past the corner (i might be wrong as i was just going up the steps by this point but my last sight of him he was just heading towards the gate). Also if you watch the youtube highlights straight after the penalty is scored, the lad who throws the pie and hits their player with it is stood directly beside a steward who doesn't even bat an eyelid never mind challenge him !!!!!!!

Even in one of the club's darkest moments there's a glint of comedy gold- better make sure the saddle's secure before you next get on your high horse PJ.

Ah yes its more important to have one over PJ

Even though he is right that older people are more likely to be prejudiced

https://www.businessinsider.com/why-are ... ?r=US&IR=T

What’s funny I am making a serious point you are choosing to be an arsehole.

Racism was bad at Pools at one point as it was in football generally for a long time I witnessed it first hand on several occasions, I remember a day like Saturday against Gillingham in about 1995 but far more than one person was being racist towards Leo Fortune-West. It was similar to Saturday in the ref got pelters (Neale Barry) and we had a couple sent off. Equally as toxic not even close to the same publicity as it was long before kick it out. So does it not surprise me the ages of the two people arrested were north of 40. No it’s what I expected, you only have to take a look at the age at your average EDL meeting of minds that these people haven’t gone away and are still a problem.

You are point scoring I am facing a serious and real issue that effects our club.

We’ll just stick our heads in the sand and stop talking about it then, nothing to see? It will just go away like it never happened.

Lock every thread....

Ah, so the racist character was 43. So is it alright for me to say it's about the right age and as I expected it would be.
Question for Yubep.
If I'm asked by the police to describe the person I saw allegedly committing a crime, am I allowed to say he is white, male, about forty, wearing jeans etc etc, or do I steer clear of that and what is the accepted way to describe someone.
I ask this because I am becoming more and more confused.
I am beginning to think the best answer is to do an Arsene Wenger and say I don't know I didn't see it or will that be seen as withholding evidence.
Also I must try and remember not to use former descriptions as ten bob, a gill of beer. and other such expressions because, although they may seem innocuous at the moment, they could still slip out when they become a hanging offence.
I like Gus Mafuta and my favourite Pools player is Peter Kioso and I would never condone any abuse of any kind thrown at them and I'm absolutely sure that they would be equally appalled if they heard any of the things I get called around here like..... you short arsed Geordie Twat. Is there anything worse you can call a Poolie than a Geordie????? That to me is the biggest racist slur I can lay my hands on but I just have to put up with it.

Its pathetic our fans already explained it away as one person which it clearly isn't, people worried about people their age being called racist than they are about actual racists

Or you could say you jumped the gun a bit and apologise to the sixty year olds you were attempting to label as a generation of racists.....but you won't will you.
Lock every thread ?????????? wouldn't that be a path of self destruction????? LOL.

The mind boggles

When you are in a hole stop digging

Yes being a white bloke from England you have experienced very little prejudice so its best to shut up

Ok then how many people were involved and who are they.
Come on enlighten us.
You clearly state that there were more and I for one want more arrests. So when are you giving the club and the police this information that I don't know and you do ??????

Derwent man what the hell you on about.

Your posts are getting cringey as fuck

Despite the 300 word post...

Yer cannot say coloured and expect people to accept it, it's 1970's or 80's anymore.

It's just not an acceptable term.

Look at the attitudes you have expressed, you clearly have no interest in educating yourself about which words are acceptable, you are part of the problem.

The police have already said 'officers expect to identify more people in relation to the alleged racist incidents and disorder.' therefore that would imply its more than one. I have also experienced many incidents of racism at Pools in the last few years, to the point where I film the penalty as I expected a racial slur to be said. So its safe to say its not one fan.

For a man who has complained more than once about posters using bad language towards you, you've escalated pretty quickly from 'smart arse' to 'arsehole.' What next?

Many of us Pools fans have expressed their dismay and disgust at the racist incident on Saturday; I'm not sure anyone else has felt the need to reach for the soap box as often as you, but that's only what we've come to expect. I thought your bit of glib pontification about the age of the - presumed - offender might give offence to fans of that generation who post on here, so tried to give you pause for thought using a little gentle irony.

Of course, that was my mistake - someone who takes himself as seriously as you do is far beyond the reach of irony. And BTW, I'm sure Unruly Poolie is right - there will be more than one fan charged with racism. I wonder if ANY of them will be be 60 or over?

Right, if you can show me, on the statute book, where I can't say "coloured" I will accept that and never use the word again and THEN you might want to answer my question as to what word or words I can use.
Can I say "white male" or "Black male" or "Brown male" or "Red male" or "yellow male".?????
If you can't answer my questions then point me in the direction where I can find answers. It's no good telling anybody what they can't say and then refusing to tell them what is acceptable.
When I know what I can use then I will have no excuse and will not have the need to be cringy, as you put it.
I am trying to do the right thing here but all people want to do is criticise my thoughts and explanations.
I am not too old to learn so hows about positive feedback instead of all the negative shit.
That's what my cringy posts are trying to establish but nobody seems to be able to enlighten me.
Why is that I wonder

Another post full snide digs, I wouldn’t have an issue if you were actually disagreeing with some of the things I have said in the thread so it’s not really escalated really if that is your definition of bad language (which I have never complained about by the way!) then you live a sheltered life.

I have given context to my original comments about age, I think they are valid enough and I wasn’t being especially specific just talking about a certain generation and certain type of football fan. But I think you know that.

The Irony is in the title of this thread by way

I have given you and others ample opportunity to educate me on what is acceptable but, funnily enough, you have shunned the opportunity. I have shown clear interest in finding out more but so far answers to my questions are not there. Why is that???
You have no evidence of any racist behaviour on my part in the Vic or anywhere else, so why am I part of the problem?????
You need to be very careful what you accuse people of because there are very clear laws protecting people from such behaviour.
I expect people who are found guilty of racist behaviour to be dealt with, using the full force of the law.
If you have photographic evidence to highlight and expose the perpetrators of racist behaviour then you'd be better served by getting on with doing that than coming on here speculating as to whether i am the problem because if you don't produce said evidence it could be you who becomes the problem.