I'm not going to waste much time replying to the above crap, other than to say the truth obviously hurts, you are still smarting from what I said almost a month ago. You are a tory, deep down you know that, for you New Labour just exorcises your guilt. Capitalism hasn't done you much good , you miserable kernt.Now do try and get some sleep , sounds like you need some.

The truth hurts does it. The problem you have is understanding what the truth is. One minute it's Tory. then Liberal and then back to Tory. So which is it????
I'll try to give you a little help, just mark me down as anti Corbyn, Abbott, Momentum et al and you'll just about get it right.

Sorry, minds were made up long before the petty squabbling about messages on buses etc after the vote. That’s a myth, this had been building up for years and polling is now showing no one has really changed their mind on how they voted.
Maybe if governments of all persuasions had opened their eyes to the fact that there’s a world outside the South East we mightn’t have ended up in this situation. This was a chance for the forgotten people to kick shite out of government, any government, because none of them listened. They all stood by while people’s jobs and subsequently lives fell apart over the past 40 years and did nowt.

This Seaborne Freight fiasco needs to be put in context. The company itself failed when an Irish Shipping company, Arklow Shipping, withdrew it’s support at this late date causing it to fail.
I wonder why

This may all be very true, but the irony of it is that post brexit those that did the above will be the ones considerably worse off. The SE bubble will prevail whilst those that gave the kicking will be thrown to the wolves. Poeple should have listened to the old saying "be careful what you wish for".

Is that you Uncle Ken?

You've got that absolutely bang on, Snowy.
An old boy told me last week that he had been waiting for over forty years for the opportunity to get out. I don't think he had been duped by propaganda.
Italy, Spain, Greece and Belgium are on the brink of financial catastrophe....AGAIN. France and Germany are creaking under the weight of having to prop up these ailing members, That's why they are so desperate for us to stay.
When the country voted to join in the first place it was a common market not the federal state Germany is dragging everyone into.
We voted for closer trading arrangements not what has emerged since. No one voted for the laws we live by to be decided in Brussels.
So if anyone wants to dig up all the lies we are allegedly being told, a good place to start would be the time of the first referendum.
Europe wants us in for the benefit of Europe, not for the benefit of Britain. Anyone who believes differently is quite welcome to freely move themselves to one of the other 27. You best hurry up though.
I'll take my chance in the Land that my forefathers carved out for me, thank you very much.
(turns up the volume on "rule Britannia")
PS.....anyone who decides to up and off to Europe, will you please take Corbyn and his cronies with you. Corby's Cronies.........I like the sound of that.

Another bit of irony. When we joined in the first place we were told then "be careful what you wish for"
Maybe that's when we should of listened.

So damned if you do, damned if you don’t, because all that would mean is that successive governments have learnt nothing if they allow it to continue. If the South East were to continue to prosper while the rest of the country limps along behind and continues the kicking there’ll be a price to pay at the ballot box. That can’t continue anymore, things have to change.
They sowed the wind and now they’re reaping the whirlwind, to quote someone who meant business.

What whirlwind? When all of this blows over our self serving MPs will probably all be better off. If they werent already rich enough. Meanwhile the rest of us will rot. And the vast majority who where OK in the grand scheme of things will probably be not so grand. You actually make it sound like it was the EU that made the SE rich and the rest of the country in turmoil.

That might well be true but its ancient history. And two wrongs dont make a right. Its widely accepted now that we will enter a period, possibly a long one, of economic strife for what? I havent read one independent expert that even remotely believes the UK will prosper from this debacle.

I'm a bit reluctant to rely on the advice of someone who describes less than 50 years as "ancient history"
Then goes on to describe both going in and now coming out as "two wrongs"
Then uses the word "expert".
Some would define expert as Ex is a has been and spurt a drip of water.
It is also said that if you put 100 economists in a room you'll be hard pressed to find two who are in full agreement with each other.
As you are watching from afar, don't you think you should get a bit nearer??
Ifs, buts and maybes eh.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

No, you simply assumed I did. The South East prospering was a direct result of neglect on the part of all governments over the last 40 years and is nothing whatsoever to do with the EU. That said, EU never made anyone rich, apart from politicians and paper shufflers because it’s a political entity when it should have been an economic one, an opportunity lost.
However, one of the useful by products of Brexit is it showed a lot of MP’s up for what they are on all sides of the house, windbags and political opportunists.

History is never ancient or irrelevant and to ignore it’s lessons is unwise.
As regards Brexit, we are were we are, so you either adapt or .......

THE EU HAS BROUGHT UNPARALLED PROSPERITY TO EUROPE, you say.

Really.
Would you like to explain why Italy, Spain, Greece, Belgium and Ireland ( to name just a few EU members) are up to their eyeballs in debt. That is debt that they have no chance of rising up from. They are on the verge of financial ruin, to the extent that they are probably going to drag the rest of Europe down with them.
Germany and France are struggling to prop the whole sorry system up and are so desperate to keep us in because without us they haven't got a chance in hell of succeeding.
The whole sorry idea is out of control and the sooner it collapses the better.
We have been a trading nation for centuries. We know how to do it. We are good at it. Let's get on with it.
All you scaremongering remoaners who run our ability to stand alone into the dust, are free to sod off to your beloved EU and let those of us who are left, free to return our country back to being the World trade leaders we have always been famous for.
Take the bureaucratic shackles off and watch us go.

In England's green and pleasant land.

Just for the record. I'll back the EU but only if it is agreed that we run it, we control it and each member state pays as much in as we do. Then it just might have a chance of being a worthwhile enterprise.

"In England's green and pleasant land.

Just for the record. I'll back the EU but only if it is agreed that we run it, we control it and each member state pays as much in as we do. Then it just might have a chance of being a worthwhile enterprise"

With due respect and that level of delusion and arrogance is why we are so disliked in the rest of Europe and part of the reason this whole mess has materialised. Days of Empire are long gone, the World has caught up and we no longer have that sort of standing in the grand scheme of things. We are a mid sized country who will never again be financially dominant either regionally or globally. We are (or were) one of the major players or four pillars running it. It's totally unrealistic to expect all members to put the same into the pot, that could never be sustainable in reality. EU membership actually gives us greater influence globally.

The EU has been around since 1958, I am not sure you can attribute the Eurozone (Eurozone not EU) financial crisis directly to EU membership. I think a theme of this whole situation is people very simplistically looking at much wider, more complex issues and using them to suit their own viewpoint.

Membership of the EU has some huge benefits that impact on all of our lives directly, free movement, he creation and sustaining of millions of jobs and absoltely crucially to me in the changing World we live in, National security. The ability for member states to share information and coordinate responses, sometimes simultaneously in several countries, is vital to the UK’s security.

This becoming more insular, being little Englanders just seems such a backward step to me in an ever evolving World. In time things might turn out ok, nobody really knows though.

Oh dear ....is that you Tony.
Don’t patronise me with stock remarks about the Murdoch Press or The Daily Mail to categorise me as it’s cobblers and I wouldn’t wipe my arse on them, but persist with such nonsense if it gives you some reasssurance in a changing world.
If you’re going to debate a point, try to actually read what’s being said. Am I a brexiteer, you assume I am, therefore in your eyes I am. You utterly fail to realise that an organisation a person supports cannot be above criticism from them.

The EU hasn’t been around since 1958. From memory without checking I’d say it’s been around since about 1992ish.

I thought we joined it in 1973!?

We joined the Common Market officially on 1st January 1973, which I voted for and was a great idea based on mutually beneficial trade . The European Union or ‘ the project’ as it’s referred to came about in the early 90’s.
A trading partnership then became a political partnership.

You got me there, PJ.
I never thought it would motivate you to reply.
On a point of order though, I am well aware that The Empire has gone, along with just about all of Lynn St.
Very sad though, don't you think, used to have some great nights in there, then on to The Empire Fish Grill in Whitby St for, what was arguably, the best fish supper in Town. We were well spoilt for good fish and chip shops in those days. I'm not quite sure what the demise of our famous Theatre and it's ancillary culinary delights has to do with the EU though. . Unless of course you are referring to the Nazi bastards who tried to deprive us with their nasty bombing raids. You may have a point there, My Son.
Ah well, never mind.

Time for an upper age limit on voting I think?

think thats why a lot who were around at the time actually voted out. quite happy in the common market days but not some political union with others.

Good post.
A lot of people in places like the North East just dont seem to realise how economically dependent we are on the EU and the benefits its gives. British Empire mentality pervades even though economic suicide is certain.

Thats when it became a Capitalist club, god knows what it would of become had Ukraine and Turkey also entered the fold.

I’m very wary of the moves by the EU to woo Ukraine and the effect it could have on the Russians. I suspect they don’t see Ukraine as an independent state, more of a buffer, which is what they like.
You have to remember the Russians fear of invasion and that was the reasoning behind the Warsaw Pact. They were buffer states so any fighting would take on someone else’s soil not Russia’s. Now the Warsaw Pact countries are in the EU they become suspicious.

During the past 40 years most of our heavy industry has been wiped out in the North East, being in then didn’t do us much good did it?
‘British Empire mentality’ is utter bollocks, who the hell believes in that crap apart from those with an interest in political self flagellation. Move on, that nonsense in the seventies was being spouted by my A level sociology teacher and she was two sheets to the wind. Jeez.