The reason for Saturday's performance - we were tired !
All teams have had the same fixture schedule and Aldershot did not look tired - they ran us ragged in the 2nd half.
He also says we have been lucky with injuries but now they are creeping in - yet only couple of weeks ago it was the hour and ten minute training regime that was preventing injuries.
I am confused .

taken from page three of the football managers book of excuses after a poor performance.

I am sure we have heard all this before.

https://www.hartlepoolmail.co.uk/sport/ ... -1-9374730

Williams out for a month! my arse ! we will be lucky to see him before Easter 2019 , if he having knee op.

Don't buy this taking it easy because they are tired either. Not saying it is this, but some may say they are tired because they have been taking it easy in training. Personally I think they have had a tough start to season in terms of games/travel etc, so we should cut them some slack.

I myself would do something different , take them away for a couple of days , walking in The Lakes or something , a different type of exercise, good for bonding and restful at same time, rather than give them time off. Nothing to say they are getting time off, but I would bet that's the case, its the HUFC way.

He should have rotated players more and subbed them etc

I feel sorry for the players if they're tired. it is exhausting doing a couple of hours training and playing a couple of games of footy every week. Poor chaps must be past themselves. We should cut them some slack.

What he’s saying probably has plenty of truth in it we’ve played 14 games in 7 weeks and spent a lot of time traveling on busses plus we’ve had a pretty settled team. On Saturday we also had a couple carrying knocks so he’s probably not wrong in saying we were a bit leggy. But it’s the one thing you should probably never say out loud, because it’s one of main things football supporters like to shout about and use loads of irrelevant comparisons like how many hours they’ve worked this week ect forgetting that comparing professional sport to everyday work is a little bit ridiculous.

I might ring 606 now and shout about my grandfather being sent down the pit at 14 at four in the morning before playing two full 90 minutes games on the afternoon and him never complaining about being tired. Games gone ect...

Good god PJ. Have a day off...

To be fair of the travelling point, most teams are based down South and their travelling times for most matches will be considerably shorter.

He can`t, it`s just who he is.

How do you think part timers manage working a full week and then 2 days training and a match?

It must be so hard training for 3 hours, playing golf, x box and a 90 minute game a week, they must be shattered and then sat on a coach for 4 hours, jesus wept, we should have a whip round and get bales of cotton wool to help protect them from the harsh conditions

Imagine turning up for work and not putting in a shift because you were a bit leggy

I don’t think saying the players are leggy is saying they aren’t putting a shift in far from it, it’s just saying they weren’t at their sharpest. It can also not just be physically it can be mentally if the game isn’t going to plan. We know Muir hadn’t trained all week because of his knock at Salford one or two others were carrying injuries.

That stuff you have just said about x boxes and golf highlights my point that I was only being half serious about.

The game has changed beyond recognition in the last 20 years, players at National League level are generally fitter than top level players used to be in years gone by and the pace of the game is fast, maybe not that pretty at times but physically and mentally demanding. But the manager shouldn’t probably say it out loud as it never goes down well.

You also finished with the ultimate stupid comparison ‘imagine turning up for work and not putting a shift because you were a bit leggy’ You can’t compare playing professional sport to a normal job, it’s the tiredest of cliches.

You`re right, most people work full time!

Judging by the times of most of the posts on the bunker i dont think there is one job between any of the contributors.

Cheeky.... Most must be MP's , Bankers or Taxi Drivers parked up awaiting fares. I picture PJ as some sort of James Bond villian, just sat looking at numerous tv / computer screens, ready to pounce.

Perhaps i may be the Director of Disaster Recovery at Hartlepool Power Station so if i go quite drive as quick as you can into the prevailing wind.

My boys going next Tuesday.

Physical tiredness - Aldershot had a long journey.
Mental tiredness - Aldershot had lost 6 on the trot away from home.
A couple of weeks ago MB was saying he wouldn't swap his squad for any other - now he says they are over achieving - please MB make up your mind.
We are simply not a "great" side - mid t able is our destination

Nobody has said we are a great side. Mid table would be a start of sorts it’s a long time since we were as good as mid table.

Why do people take what a manager says to the press in interviews they are obliged to do literally and pick the bones out of every word they say? They rarely say anything worthwhile unless they are Jose Mourinho chasing a pay off and rarely criticise players outside the four walls of the dressing room. It’s usually just bland chat straight from the managers text book. It normally happens at Pools when everyone wants a manager out so for Bates to be at this stage after 2 defeats in 14 is good going. Imagine the reaction if we had lost on Saturday!?

That.............

Fair point.

To be fair, I agree with PJ’s point about comparison’s - football isn’t a normal job but like any job it comes with pressure. Teams do tire especially where they are punching a little above their weight. Also agree that you can’t say it out loud, as PJ just proved there. That said I don’t expect to hear it said again.
We’re just not quite the real deal yet unfortunately but so much better than last season. Have enjoyed quite a few games in the last couple of months - couldn’t say that about last season. Think there’ll be plenty more good days to come but we just need to tweak something when playing at home.

Think most agree we are better than last season. Most agree mid table finish would be acceptable after last few seasons. Most seem to think this team aren't good enough to go up, but could sneak into play offs possibly. Most are reasonably happy with things so far, better than expected , but having seen how open the league is and the standard of some of the opposition, most now expect a bit more than mid table or sneaking into play offs.

My view is this. The team aren't good enough for top 3 spot, but is the manager getting the best out of what he has got? my view is he isn't. Having a manager who knows what he is doing could be worth between 12-15 extra points over a season, or the difference say between finishing 12th or 7th. If no new signings are forthcoming Bates has to get the best out of the players currently at his disposal, especially at home.

Revert to 4-4-2 on Saturday and come out all guns blazing.

Agree with both SSS and harden - we are considerably better than last season but nothing better than a top half finish is on the cards at present. This would not represent a disaster to the realists but something definitely needs to change at home otherwise we will be enforced to endure yet more of the recent ‘Groundhog Days’ that are slowly but surely resulting in quite understandable unrest on the terraces.

If Raj is truly serious about increasing attendances to >4K then he’s going to need to help Bates out in strengthening his wafer-thin squad. Conversely, Bates needs to come up with some fresh ideas that will result in his side being rather less predictable at the Vic and also as horden says get the best out of his players several of whom were well under par on Saturday.

As regards the ‘tired players’ debate, Noble had already alluded to this (by his own admission at the risk of annoying Bates) during a post-match interview with the goon from Radio Borer on Saturday so it was hardly a surprise when Bates also referenced this as a part-excuse for a questionable team performance. This may be so and also acceptable as a one-off after the small squad played twice per week during August and September thanks to a seemingly deranged NL fixture compiler. However this certainly won’t wash with the fans or media going forward into the autumn/winter fixtures when one game per week will be the norm.

Or like my dyslexic baker granda in the war, all buns glazing!

I have burnt pies, mash, pizzas, pork and even water once but I didn`t bitch it was because I was leggy, it was because I was busy doing 4 other tasks at the same time and took my eye of the boil

Why would you be leggy in kitchen?

Imagine if every time you turned the oven on your opposite number turned it off. Or carrying a dish someone slide tackles you and knocks it out of your hand. While the whole dining room are booing you.

This is how absurd this tired comparison is in relation to sports. You have in footballs case eleven people in opposition trying to stop you doing your job, then you have an opposition manager and coaches instructing those players to stop you doing your job. If your are a bit leggy or tired mentally you will not do your job to the very best of your ability you will be a little off, you won’t try any less some days you might try too hard when this is the case. It is sport and that is the nature of it and it’s nothing like going to work and doing a normal job, nothing. It’s not an excuse it’s just that footballers aren’t robots very few especially at Pools level can reproduce their very best every time, that is why they playing in the fifth tier.

What a contradiction ! You defend Bates and then say we have an unbalanced squad, the one Bates created and yet you no doubt would give him another summer to correct it, bizarre !.

The problem at HUFC isnt sacking managers every other season, its consistently picking the wrong managers in the first place.

As for on the wings, how about Hawkes and Donaldson?.

Hignett out then, he's to blame for the unbalanced squad you talk of. Does Hignett pick the team?.

Hawkes has played on the wing before, not that it matters, he is a young lad and I am sure he could play anywhere in midfield or up front.

Donaldson is/was once a forward, but is now a wing back, so what.

Is it just a Hartlepool thing to massively overrate/hype any youngster who makes a first team appearance?

Who do you refer to? I have never noticed this happen. If anything its the opposite. We usually wrap them up in cotton wool, play them once, drop them, let them go out on loan and then release them.

We don’t have the players to play 4-4-2. It doesn’t suit our any of our midfield to play in a two and we don’t have wide options. I’d like us to stick with 5-3-2 away and try 4-3-3 at home.

As for the unbalanced squad when only a limited amount of players were out of contract and we don’t have a massive budget to play with none of the current regime are to ‘blame’ its just going to take more than one transfer window to sort out.

Since the weekend it’s been like a nonsense talking competition on here at times.

Nigh on every youngster who ever plays such as Richardson last season and now Hawkes.

The fact we may 'play them once, drop them, let them go out on loan and then release them' is usually because they are not good enough and thats judged by the people who see them everyday.

Iv no idea how putting an 18 year old kid into a position he doesnt play, in a formation that doesnt suit hardly any of our players could actually help in any way.

PJ sports Guru, you really do talk bollocks.

I have burnt pies, mash, pizzas, pork and even water once but I didn`t bitch it was because I was leggy, it was because I was busy doing 4 other tasks at the same time and took my eye of the boil [/quote]

Why would you be leggy in kitchen?

Imagine if every time you turned the oven on your opposite number turned it off. Or carrying a dish someone slide tackles you and knocks it out of your hand. While the whole dining room are booing you.

This is how absurd this tired comparison is in relation to sports. You have in footballs case eleven people in opposition trying to stop you doing your job, then you have an opposition manager and coaches instructing those players to stop you doing your job. If your are a bit leggy or tired mentally you will not do your job to the very best of your ability you will be a little off, you won’t try any less some days you might try too hard when this is the case. It is sport and that is the nature of it and it’s nothing like going to work and doing a normal job, nothing. It’s not an excuse it’s just that footballers aren’t robots very few especially at Pools level can reproduce their very best every time, that is why they playing in the fifth tier.[/quote]

PJ sports Guru, you really do talk bollocks.[/quote]

Am agreeing with Mr Butt here. In my job there are teams in opposition, trying to do me/ my client over - except they are usually in suits - bankers, lawyers, accountants - and, if I get 'leggy' and don't deliver, I get sued. Simples. So I think that Mr Butt's comparisons have some substance. And to throw in a new spin - they call themselves 'professionals' - I call myself a professional and this carries with it everything from the need to be insured for certain work through to having all sorts of disciplinary/ conduct/ ethics rules and so forth to attend to. And I need to do work for more than a few hours before warming down.....

You don’t have an equivalent of getting ‘leggy’ in your job because it isn’t professional sport. You can’t compare making a serious error that would get you in legal trouble to physical and mental fatigue that are an invevatibilty and consequence of playing sport. It is a totally different World. Plus you use the term ‘simples’ that should be enough to get you sued alone.

Are you seriously suggesting footballers or teams should never have a bad game or ever lack a bit of spark because they are professionals? In most cases the eleven against them are also professionals so that doesn’t really stack up.

At the end of the day we didn’t play well, we drew and now we have a chance put it right on Saturday. You’d honestly think we were bottom of the League.

I’ve avoided the bunker mostly this week as I felt it’s a bit too negative.

This thread confirms I’ve made the right choice


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The squad needs your services, stronger leg muscles required

And you won it

There are no winners. It's turning into the Somme. A turgid stalemate of opinions lobbed over to be countered by more opinions lobbed back over by people who don't in reality know the full picture probably anyway.
It's all speculative opinion, just opinion and if anyone wants to know why we've never won anything of consequence in our history, it's because some folk are incapable of change, stuck in a tram line of fixed opinions from sport to politics and just bang away with the same pessimistic line of gloom till they're screwing the lid down.

Contradictions there Snowy. The pessimists you speak of ( I assume I am one of them ) are the very people who are not stuck in a tram line of fixed opinions or incapable of change, we have wanted change more or less since time began. There has been little change ( IOR excepted ) that has made the club capable of winning anything. What is worse is the vast majority rush to protect the club , despite the club making the same mistakes over and over again, I would argue its those people who are the problem and responsible for the club winning diddly squat in its history, but hey ho, what do I know, its only speculative theory on a football message board , the spiritual home of speculative theories.

I sometimes wonder how I would react if I owned the football club, having just pulled it back from the brink of oblivion, only to find the current wave of comment on our position just a matter of months after taking control.
We are in transition and have certainly moved away from the dire position we were in only a few short months ago.
We are a work in progress and a fair way from the finished article that will get us back into the football league and, what is more important, have the structure to stay there. Unlike Macclesfield who, at the moment, look like dropping straight back.
If a few months ago, when the grim reaper was brandishing his scythe, we had been told that by the end of September we would be challenging for a play off place, having lost only two games, we would probably consider that prospect to be nothing short of a miracle.
Think about it, people.

Snowy says "..........just bang away with the same pessimistic line of gloom till they're screwing the lid down."

I'm now mid 70's and have supported a football league club for over 60 years. Is it asking too much to want to see us back where I believe we belong before the lid is screwed down?

I think everyone can accept that players will have the occasional off day. Talk of players being leggy 14 games into a 46 game season is borderline ludicrous. MB obviously thinks that is the case or he wouldn't have said it. Do we not employ a full time fitness coach who is supposed to get the players fit and then organise the recovery for the players.

I'd also argue that other jobs are subject to mental fatigue (not mine admittedly) but to suggest that they are not is just wrong.

Since we have been a non league team, we have been woefully poor as a team in the latter part of matches. Even part time teams seem stronger, late on in games, christ even braintree who we tortured looked fitter in the last 10 minutes.

I suspect that after 45 minutes, most opposition have worked out that we offer such a feeble goal threat that they fancy their chances of a result and give it a go. Bates should try 433 at home and allow one striker (Muir?) the luxury of not working himself into the ground in order to take sharp chances. So far the work rate of our forwards is laudable but it hasn't led to many goals.

Putting an extra man on the pitch should certainly help, like

Thanks for pointing that out. Now edited.

IOR apart, grumbling hasn't worked for the past 110 years has it, or have I missed something? Nothing is achieved by whinging. There are times when complaining is totally justified, but making an art form of constant griping over every little thing serves no constructive purpose, it just adds to the sniping. If you want a positive outcome, you have to have one too.
'Back where we belong' ? Where do we belong, where does any club belong. They're all as good as their playing record and ours has us in the National League because we just weren't good enough. I suspect you should be complaining to the two previous owners, not the those trying to get the club back on it's feet

"Back where we/they belong" is the worst football related comment ever.