Oi, You! Chip

Mr Irrelevant · **Joined:** Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:25 pm **Posts:** 22671

Filed at companies house yesterday.

Attachment:

application-pdf.pdf

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

Another loan, from a different company?

What the fook?

Malcolm Dawes Knew My Father · **Joined:** Wed May 11, 2011 4:25 pm **Posts:** 4198

Hang on a minute - isn't this loan supposed to be guaranteed against HUFC's "leasehold" of the Vic?
What exactly does the club have leasehold over? Fixtures and fittings are all that has been talked about in the past.

born toulouse · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:03 pm

I'm not Chip but it looks like Coxhall has got a secured loan off this lot as well. Again secured against Pools' assets. I suppose there could be a legit reason for doing that but other than paying the other lot back by borrowing at a lower rate I can't think what. Even that would suggest that the Access finance loan was a panic measure not a way of funding an investment.

ElvisC · **Joined:** Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:55 am **Posts:** 4504

..the needle returns to the start of the song...

yloop · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:07 pm

Article 6.5 on that document... So does the land have a covenant?

Joe Mac · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:10 pm

In simple terms we are borrowing money against the club and it's assets for this pie in the sky idea?

The Colonel · **Joined:** Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:49 am **Posts:** 4891

ANd it seems the lender has Receiver rights too.

But hey, lets all sit back and wait and see.

Fucking scary.

Joe Mac · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:21 pm

I'm just off to Seaton to dig a hole and bury my head in the sand.

StocksfieldPoolie · **Joined:** Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:48 pm **Posts:** 324

If I remember correctly and to quote Tommy Widdrington "We are Hartlepool NOT Liverpool".

The Colonel · **Joined:** Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:49 am **Posts:** 4891

or Arsenal. Or Reading

tREE_wiTH_hAMStER · **Joined:** Sat May 19, 2007 11:00 am **Posts:** 20758

But I thought Access Finance were all the rage? Why are we now loaning off someone else?

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

Because they lend a maximum of £1 million, which suggests to me that's what we borrowed the other week.

Hold on tight everyone.

thebigdog · **Joined:** Sat Aug 10, 2013 6:49 pm **Posts:** 1278

Good god, it doesn't get any better does it

The Colonel · **Joined:** Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:49 am **Posts:** 4891

Lets wait till Gary makes his huge announcement that is going to blow us all away.

StocksfieldPoolie · **Joined:** Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:48 pm **Posts:** 324

I look forward to what can be found by the "keyboard detectives" for Sage Investments Ltd based in Chorley.

ElvisC · **Joined:** Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:55 am **Posts:** 4504

StocksfieldPoolie wrote:

I look forward to what can be found by the "keyboard detectives" for Sage Investments Ltd based in Chorley.

Give us some thyme !!

Mr Irrelevant · **Joined:** Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:25 pm **Posts:** 22671

They're a proper firm. Decent level of assets and have been around a while and are into property development. My concerns are more over why we need to hock the ground to everyone we speak to.

StocksfieldPoolie · **Joined:** Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:48 pm **Posts:** 324

What has Mr Coxhall got to lose?

Is it his money?
What happens if it goes wrong?
What happens to HUFC?

We have everything to lose

OUR football club!

And would anyone with their OWN money put money into this scheme?

If Mr Coxhall was putting his own money and was taking all the risks, then fair play BUT not with OUR football club!

ElvisC · **Joined:** Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:55 am **Posts:** 4504

Mr Coxall answered me on Twitter several weeks ago that it would be HIM that would lose everything if it didn't work. He was very specific..not the Football Club, not JPNG, him. I followed this up with "Surely it would be Peter Goldberg" , and he didn't respond.

Personally I'm scratching my head at how he would lose anything, when it's HUFC, our football club, on these loan documents? That's this one, and the Access Finance one...

StocksfieldPoolie · **Joined:** Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:48 pm **Posts:** 324

If it all goes guano, then as you say it is HUFC named on the loan documents not Coxhall!
Did you inform him you had seen the earlier document?

StocksfieldPoolie · **Joined:** Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:48 pm **Posts:** 324

And if he was somehow going to take the hit, surely he would just declare himself bankrupt!

Mr Irrelevant · **Joined:** Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:25 pm **Posts:** 22671

I'm looking at their Experian report now and they're clean. Two long standing directors - husband a wife. The business grew substantially between 2013/14 and they declare a strong profit. The business is worth far more than the entire long list of Goldberg's companies past and present including Pools.

Mr Irrelevant · **Joined:** Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:25 pm **Posts:** 22671

ElvisC wrote:

Mr Coxall answered me on Twitter several weeks ago that it would be HIM that would lose everything if it didn't work. He was very specific..not the Football Club, not JPNG, him. I followed this up with "Surely it would be Peter Goldberg" , and he didn't respond.

Utter nonsense!

Malcolm Dawes Knew My Father · **Joined:** Wed May 11, 2011 4:25 pm **Posts:** 4198

It would be interesting to know if there are any grants available that could potentially go towards the redevelopment?

The Live Theatre on the Newcastle Quayside has been acquiring adjacent properties with public money for the last decade, to the same end - to give them a guaranteed income that's additional to their core business.

The difference - and it's pretty bloody major - is that Live Theatre is a charitable trust and 'ownership' is vested in a voluntary board.

If only HUFC was at least part owned by a not-for-profit organisation...and it would look good on those grant applications.

monkeybutt · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 6:07 pm

StocksfieldPoolie wrote:

And if he was somehow going to take the hit, surely he would just declare himself bankrupt!

Again ?

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

ElvisC wrote:

Mr Coxall answered me on Twitter several weeks ago that it would be HIM that would lose everything if it didn't work. He was very specific..not the Football Club, not JPNG, him. I followed this up with "Surely it would be Peter Goldberg" , and he didn't respond.

Personally I'm scratching my head at how he would lose anything, when it's HUFC, our football club, on these loan documents? That's this one, and the Access Finance one...

Surely he wouldn't get this sort of credit against his own name given his past? It's outright bollocks.

As has been said it's past the point of no return now so let's hope and pray he can make a success of this because the alternative is the demise of our football club. Happy New Year everyone.

In the short term (because these aren't short term plans) how will the club manage the repayments if even before them we can't pay the tax man on time?

Brian Honour's Left Foot · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 6:18 pm

Given that both sets of charges cover leased assets - wouldn't the freeholder have been involved at some stage in the lendor D/D and subsequent legals?

Snowy · **Joined:** Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:18 pm **Posts:** 37695

I'm going to build an Ark. It looks like the best option with this massive cloud over our heads. This is all so depressing.

MutleyRules · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 7:47 pm

This is all scarey stuff....REAL SCAREY!!!! sadx

Brian Honour's Left Foot · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 7:50 pm

Chip Fireball wrote:

Brian Honour's Left Foot wrote:

Given that both sets of charges cover leased assets - wouldn't the freeholder have been involved at some stage in the lendor D/D and subsequent legals?

This is the point I made when I saw the documentation from Access Finance. There was a particular clause I didn't like ( think it was 3.1.1 ) because it related to the lease. In normal commercial tenancies ( assuming they are leases and opted into into the 54 Act ) you would not normally expect that lease to be transferrable to a Lender or for it to be referenced in a secured loan agreement.

In this instance though it was, which may be simply down to them using a template document and not reviewing all of the clauses. However any half decent solicitor reviewing the paperwork would immediately have flagged it up and had it withdrawn.

But that's assuming a solicitor reviewed it and the loan was coming from a reputable bank whose own solicitor had drafted it, not something written on the back of a fag packet and signed after 3 days down the pub.

From what I saw it was quite clear that were the club to default on the loan, then the Lender could at least in theory, become the leaseholder of the land/ground. However one would like to think the Landlord ( HBC ) has a provision in the lease to prevent this happening.

Without seeing all the paperwork its guesswork.

True, but very good questions; and we know that there is a sporting covenant on the lease - so - as Elvis sang, 'I'm watching the detectives.....'

Dalton'sHaircut · **Joined:** Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:26 pm **Posts:** 1013

I'm not panicking until I read what's really happening in the Northern Echo rather than all this amateur detective work done by keyboard warriors.....

yloop · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:09 pm

Well that pdf says that the loan can only be agreed if there's no conflicting covenant on the land.

Mr Irrelevant · **Joined:** Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:25 pm **Posts:** 22671

I don't believe there is one at the moment.

The Bishop · **Posted:** Fri Jan 06, 2017 11:01 pm

Not a legal Eagle or owt, but just to put things in perspective, it took Bishops years to sell their part of Kingsway (I understand)due to the sporting covenant, also The Aclet pub is still open due to the covenant (pub/Hotel) on that (developers want to knock it Down and build houses/shops).

Anyway my convoluted point is these things "should" take time and can be fought. Its time to worry but not panic.

I agree with earlier posters. The Club needs to be more open and also IMHO why people should join the Trust.

Oi, You! Chip

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