Imagine my shock...

Yubep · **Joined:** Wed Jan 31, 2007 6:35 pm **Posts:** 25266

Returning home to another ground sale article that doesn't appear to say much or go anywhere...

http://m.hartlepoolmail.co.uk/news/loca ... -1-6370241

parmo · **Posted:** Tue Jan 14, 2014 6:52 pm

we'll still be reading about this in years to come

Shocking!!!

Fetish_Bob · **Posted:** Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:37 pm

parmo wrote:

we'll still be reading about this in years to come Shocking!!!

I disagree with you Parmo and the reason I do is simple because Drummond is no longer the Mayor. The Mill House Master Plan and the giving/sale of the ground to Pools was a Drummond idea. Now Labour won't just be blocking it simply because it was his idea. They've never forgiven him for defeating their man, and if a labour man had been in power, we would still have an elected mayor. They couldn't beat him that way so they got rid of the position. I now believe they'll be ready to give a little(if thats right words) and we could see some progress that previously I would have totally agreed with you. Just my opinion based on nothing in particular apart from the fact that labour will get the plaudits and they'll take all the praise for revenue raised from the sale of the Vic.

parmo · **Posted:** Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:43 pm

possibly,but the full situation has got folks disinterested!!! A 35 year old chess game!!

jgert · **Joined:** Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:31 pm **Posts:** 151

Fetish_Bob wrote:

parmo wrote:

we'll still be reading about this in years to come Shocking!!!

They've never forgiven him for defeating their man, and if a labour man had been in power, we would still have an elected mayor. They couldn't beat him that way so they got rid of the position.

I thought it was the people of Hartlepool who didn't turn out to vote for Drummond who got rid of him.

tREE_wiTH_hAMStER · **Joined:** Sat May 19, 2007 11:00 am **Posts:** 20758

Fairly obvious by the wording that Ken offered a derisory amount.

Mr Ripper · **Posted:** Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:10 pm

Valued at £625k by who?

By Pools, by the council or independently?

tREE_wiTH_hAMStER · **Joined:** Sat May 19, 2007 11:00 am **Posts:** 20758

Chip Fireball wrote:

Got fuck all to do with Drummond IMHO.The original Millhouse Masterplan was the biggest load of horseshit imagineable, and nobody in their right mind would have sanctioned it given even the bloke from Robinsons stood up at the meeting at the Vic and said they were millions short of the investment needed and had fuck all chance of finding it. It was just a load of projections on a white board with no money behind it.

Bob you seem to be completely overlooking the FACT Labour didnt even have a majority for a big chunk of Drummonds reign. They seem quite prepared as they have been in the past to sell the ground for what they consider to be a reasoanle price. If IOR want it all they have to do is pay up and its theirs.

Personally I hope they dont get it until we get some semblance of honesty from them, though I can understand why club men would want them to have it.

What happened to the fans forum by the way ? Havent heard a dickie bird in months ?

Last meeting was cancelled so that's probably it.

Must admit it lasted longer than I thought, was certain it would have been just the one meeting.

MutleyRules · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:50 am

Was it 2 meetings they had????

Yubep · **Joined:** Wed Jan 31, 2007 6:35 pm **Posts:** 25266

It sounds like the only purpose of the meetings was to sort out the bottle lids and for people to grass up people coming with other peoples season tickets.

Now thats sorted no need for meetings.

tREE_wiTH_hAMStER · **Joined:** Sat May 19, 2007 11:00 am **Posts:** 20758

MutleyRules wrote:

Was it 2 meetings they had????

Think so aye.

offshorepoolie · **Joined:** Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:32 pm **Posts:** 6011

Sounds like another millhouse master plan.. Get the people onside spout off for a while and then do a runner before you have to sort out any real problems..

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Joe Mac · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 10:35 am

Fans Panel was set up when we had a shite start to the season and hadn't won a league game, results picked up and it seems to have just been swept under the carpet.

offshorepoolie · **Joined:** Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:32 pm **Posts:** 6011

I wonder if they'll dig up the corpse again as we haven't been doing exceptionally since they wrapped it up.. Oh on a side issue was there an agm this year?

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derwent · **Joined:** Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:59 pm **Posts:** 12368

I believe a fans panel meeting is scheduled for early Feb.
On the ground sale price, they should agree to get three independent valuations and either use the middle one or take an average of all three and then commit to it. I can't see a much fairer way than that.

horden · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:01 pm

Would be okay If IOR could be trusted, unfortunately I don't trust them.

alienlife · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:17 pm

horden wrote:

Would be okay If IOR could be trusted, unfortunately I don't trust them.

Why? They've been here the best part of two decades and in that time the club has been more successful than ever without ever getting into the kind of trouble the only comparable club of our size and level in the area managed.

I'm certainly not a clubman but I'm not at all suspicious of IOR.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

horden wrote:

Would be okay If IOR could be trusted, unfortunately I don't trust them.

How many crisis free years do they need to own the club before we stop reading horseshit like that, we're at 17 now so 25?? 30?? 40??

It would be a show of great patience to wait this long before unleashing this dastardly masterplan to crush the club.

Unreal.

alienlife · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:38 pm

For the record I'd trust Ken Hodcroft or anyone else employed by IOR to do a better job of running anything than the current power hungry councillors we have running the town.

alienlife · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:44 pm

The Mill House Masterplan looks way more plausible than Ackers-Belchers latest distraction from how clueless the council is www.forum.hartlepoolpost.co.uk/index.ph ... 429.0.html

tREE_wiTH_hAMStER · **Joined:** Sat May 19, 2007 11:00 am **Posts:** 20758

Also don't trust them and never want them To own the ground.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

I agree a bit more clarity is required regarding a couple of issues, especially the ground, but distrust?

Seriously?

The 'debt' has always appeared in the accounts hasn't it? steadily building over the 17 years. It was certainly always mentioned at AGM's

I'm also of the opinion that until we get more clarity I'm happy for the council to own the ground but at the same time after running the club on such stable footing for as long as they have it's hard to build an argument for them not having the clubs best interests at heart.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

Just a gut feeling I think the truth of the matter is right now the ground sale issue has cooled because IOR's desire for it to happen has for the time being.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

Just Google the words 'Berge' and 'Larsen' and you might be led to a story about where he will be spending the next five years....

derwent · **Joined:** Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:59 pm **Posts:** 12368

Chip Fireball wrote:

Well, precisely.

At the end of the day we are in a similar league position to where we were when IOR or whoever took over, heavily reliant on kids to supplement a small squad, though admittedly with a better infrastructure.

In the beginning spending money on the football club was not an issue for them, there seemed to be plenty of it. Now the money appears to have dried up to the point where they are even having to farm out the shirt sponsorship, and we are being told the club has to be self-sufficent.

I dont have a problem with IOR or whoever pulling the plug on funding, likewise I dont have a problem with Pools having to be self sufficent and to operate on what it generates as income.

What I do have a problem with is the council handing the ground over to owners we know nothing about.

I accept what people are saying about giving them the benefit of the doubt, but one question I keep asking myself is a fairly simple one. If they genuinely wanted the ground, and it was vital to safeguarding the future of the football club, why didnt they just buy it ?

We are constantly being told they keep ploughing £1 million a season into the club, with the money they have spent they could have bought the club a dozen times over .

Exactly.
I don't trust them, never have and until they are more transparent, never will. I could never understand why they put so much store in owning the ground and yet never put in an " impossible to refuse " bid.
If they are adamant that no more money is to be put in to cover any shortfall in the club's finances, then what good are they to the club?????
They have propped the club up in the past, of that there is no doubt but all I am interested in is the club's future.
They need to take a leaf out of Harold Hornsey's manual and admit they can't/won't take the club any further and find somebody who can/will. Not an easy task admittedly but if they refuse to finance the place, then the place is no worse off without them. It's called reality.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

How exactly are they 'refusing' to finance the place?

The bills are still getting paid, we're still signing players. Yes maybe IOR aren't throwing the cash at us they were a couple of years ago but maybe it's a case of because of other issues (see Google search recommendation) they can't. It could be temporary. So we're running a model that is a lot closer to self sufficiency than we have previously. Is that wrong on the owners part? Are we stomping our feet just because we are being asked to cut our cloth accordingly. Or do you essentially want a sugar Daddy who will bankroll the club? Because what you mean by 'fund' is give the club his money. I don't see a queue of those people snaking down Clarence Road and the grass certainly isn't always greener on the other side, especially regarding some of the characters who get involved in football.

We still have a competitive wage bill, only this week a player has decided to join us over other offers.

All I think is needed is a bit more clarity on the current situation, like I said I think the interest in buying the Vic has cooled for one I'm not even sure as speak that it's a major issue.

offshorepoolie · **Joined:** Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:32 pm **Posts:** 6011

!?!?

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The Fat Man · **Joined:** Wed Jun 10, 2009 4:03 pm **Posts:** 2107

I've never been happy with the idea of the council selling the ground; a long lease is more than sufficient for any owners. I wouldn't say that I don't trust IOR, but a little transparency would help. For me, the issue is what happens post IOR; they won't be here forever, owners never are. If we completely trusted IOR, there's no guarantee that the next owners, or the next (etc) can be trusted, and a council owned ground gives us a little security.

I was talking to my mate the other day, who's a Kiddy fan, and they've just sacked their manager in dubious circumstances. He was a bit pissed off, but went on to say that he's not too worried about the owner's plans, as it's a council owned ground, and at least he'll not be able to fully turn them over...

Loid Haw-Haw of Sussex · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:21 pm

PJPoolie wrote:

Just Google the words 'Berge' and 'Larsen' and you might be led to a story about where he will be spending the next five years....

BLOODY HELL...Why hasn't this been mentioned before pj ?

parmo · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:27 pm

http://www.thelocal.no/20131004/maveric ... five-years

parmo · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:28 pm

he's been sacked anorl

http://www.newsabah.com/ar/2125/26/63092/dno.htm?tpl=21

Mr Irrelevant · **Joined:** Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:25 pm **Posts:** 22671

Wow! incidentally did you note the phrase;

Quote:

The judge ruled that Larsen had set up an "ingenious" system involving "mispriced options and stock transactions, tax havens, and back-dating documents" to protect a fortune worth some 645 million kroner ($108m) from taxation in Norway.

offshorepoolie · **Joined:** Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:32 pm **Posts:** 6011

Because everybody loves him .. So who does own pools?

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grabec · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:43 pm

offshorepoolie wrote:

Because everybody loves him .. So who does own pools?

The words presented may not be the ones inputted ..Thanks Tapatalk

Sussex, probably. If you manage to squat somewhere for a certain number of years, the property becomes yours.

offshorepoolie · **Joined:** Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:32 pm **Posts:** 6011

So we been owned by a clever version of Georgie R.. I'm sure all this was mentioned in one of the "conspiracy" threads and was poo pooed by the elite

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Fatty eats roadkill · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:56 pm

Hey PJ I guess I wasn't on crack when I posted about your squeaky clean owner :laugh:

Loid Haw-Haw of Sussex · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:03 pm

There must have been a 100 threads about GR..and now this.I'm still in shock..

alleztfc · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:05 pm

Keep on dreaming, Desperado...

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

Fatty eats roadkill wrote:

Hey PJ I guess I wasn't on crack when I posted about your squeaky clean owner :laugh:

He isn't our owner.

alleztfc · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:12 pm

Don't confuse them with the truth man. They've been bull-shitted and deceived for years. So much they think it passes for legitimate behaviour. And just look at them now!

born toulouse · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:20 pm

Larsen's dislike of tax has been public knowledge for years, he is even less fond of paying it than Bono. If I was the Norweigan tax man I'd hate him. But I'm not, I'm a Pools fan and the group of companies he is a major shareholder in seem to have looked after us quite well for 17 years.

I'd be very surprised if he does a single day inside, strangely enough people with more than £100 million in the bank rarely lose their appeals. You can't compare them to people with a few grand in their car boot.

alleztfc · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:23 pm

Whoever can you be referring to?

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

born toulouse wrote:

Larsen's dislike of tax has been public knowledge for years, he is even less fond of paying it than Bono. If I was the Norweigan tax man I'd hate him. But I'm not, I'm a Pools fan and the group of companies he is a major shareholder in seem to have looked after us quite well for 17 years.

I'd be very surprised if he does a single day inside, strangely enough people with more than £100 million in the bank rarely lose their appeals. You can't compare them to people with a few grand in their car boot.

Forgetting the pointless idiots sidetracking the thread, my theory is that a slow down in the amount of investment has coincided with this case. It could be pure coincidence I don't know.

offshorepoolie · **Joined:** Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:32 pm **Posts:** 6011

The money appearing on our balance sheet also coincided with this court case too

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born toulouse · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:37 pm

I don't know either but my guess is that investment has slowed because IOR have a business plan based on owning and developing the ground so that Pools' turnover increases way beyond where it could get to on crowds alone. That would allow us to build a squad that could compete at a higher level without breaking FFP rules.

If he is really in deep shit I would have thought getting cash off the books would be a good idea- maybe that is what Big Stevie was all about and it would also explain the sudden appearance of debt in subsidiaries.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

born toulouse wrote:

I don't know either but my guess is that investment has slowed because IOR have a business plan based on owning and developing the ground so that Pools' turnover increases way beyond where it could get to on crowds alone. That would allow us to build a squad that could compete at a higher level without breaking FFP rules.

If he is really in deep shit I would have thought getting cash off the books would be a good idea- maybe that is what Big Stevie was all about and it would also explain the sudden appearance of debt in subsidiaries.

Then the six million dollar question remains, why not just meet the councils asking price? They agreed to sell the ground in principle if they did that years ago.

Loid Haw-Haw of Sussex · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 6:18 pm

"My theory is..." "I'm guessing...".."The six million dollar question remains ..." :laugh:

Spender · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 6:38 pm

born toulouse wrote:

I don't know either but my guess is that investment has slowed because IOR have a business plan based on owning and developing the ground so that Pools' turnover increases way beyond where it could get to on crowds alone. That would allow us to build a squad that could compete at a higher level without breaking FFP rules.

If he is really in deep shit I would have thought getting cash off the books would be a good idea- maybe that is what Big Stevie was all about and it would also explain the sudden appearance of debt in subsidiaries.

I must avoid smilies here.

If IOR owned the ground, they could get 100% of any ground improvement funds granted.

If they don't they only qualify for 50%.

PJPoolie · **Joined:** Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:28 pm **Posts:** 15342

The Ghost of Sussex07 wrote:

"My theory is..." "I'm guessing...".."The six million dollar question remains ..." :laugh:

Non of those apply to you being sad 'lovely lovely person'.

That can be stated with absolute certainty.

Can anyone tell me what he adds to this place, along with Fatty Eats Ketamine?? I'm saying fuck all especially in threads like this when we're discussing our club. I wouldn't care if he was original or funny, he just buzzes like an annoying Wasp that won't get the message.

Loid Haw-Haw of Sussex · **Posted:** Thu Jan 16, 2014 7:07 pm

PJPoolie wrote:

The Ghost of Sussex07 wrote:

"My theory is..." "I'm guessing...".."The six million dollar question remains ..." :laugh:

Non of those apply to you being sad 'lovely lovely person'.

That can be stated with absolute certainty.

Can anyone tell me what he adds to this place, along with Fatty Eats Ketamine?? I'm saying fuck all especially in threads like this when we're discussing our club. I wouldn't care if he was original or funny, he just buzzes like an annoying Wasp that won't get the message.

You just can't take it pj...you've proved it time and time again...you wouldn't last a day with the piss takers i work with.. :laugh:

Imagine my shock...

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