I guess that you cannot work out that 4,500 people @ £15ea. = £67,500 gate money but 2,600 people @ £20ea. = £52,000.



PS. I know that concessions etc would affect these calcs but they're more indicative than finite.

And you could guarantee these 1900 fans would turn up again?

i highly doubt that anywhere near 1900 extra people would turn up by knocking a fiver off the price.

i think it would be good as a one off.

I thought you had done one?

Why dont you answer the question that got asked to you..... what difference dco you think this "promotion" will make?

As I have said in a reply to a letter in the mail, can you guarantee 4,500 people at£15 each, and of course the answer is NO Your suddenly presuming 1900 of the "missing fans" will turn up. In reality it will be something like 500 ( and that probably an over estimation) meaning 3100 at £15 meaning £46,500 as opposed to your figure of £52,000 for 2,600. Approx 1000 of the "missing fans would need to attend for the £52,000 to be increased., even 900 more fans would only increase your figure by £500.

So can you guess which is better financially for Pools at the moment and it's charging the £20 unless 900 fans say they WILL definitely attend, any less and Pools LOSE MONEY on that game.

I'm not saying they shouldn't reduce admission cost but you can't simply use figures to try to prove an argument.

Because I can show figures can be used in a different way and show that even a cheaper admission charge can mean less income. Pools have those 2600 (we're down to the die-hards) and although cost is predominately a factor it's not the only one.

Talk of sub 2,000 is OTT.

Put 2,600 into context, it was during the most horrible spell of weather we've had in decades I'd imagine plenty of season ticket holdes didn't even go. Right up to kick off both games recently could have been called off.

I'd imagine we'll be back to 3,100-3,300 on Saturday, that is what we are down to not 2,600.

A bigger one then if the did nothing

The club are doing something positive and the only people being negative are the tatties on here.

Burn in hell you sad tw@ts - you know who you are

you can wrap it up with "i'm just stating my opinion etc" but it don't wash. back them or burn

3,500 @ £15ea. = £52,500.

IF it worked and they increased the attendance from 2,600 to 3,500 they'd lose nowt.

You assume it wouldn't but you don't KNOW that to be the case.

And then there'd always be some smartarse who would quite rightly say that there's no way of knowing what the attendance would have been on that given day at the original admission prices.

Like I said previously though, think groups of people. Think about the people who can afford it but aren't going cos their mates can't afford to. Think about the fact that people might make the effort to go just because the admission is reduced and it tempts them where previously they've been indifferent. Think about the people who keep saying that £20 isn't value for money.

Or would you rather just not try owt and just assume that these people are "lost" for good?

I'm not trying to use figures to prove an argument, I'm using them as an indicator as to a potential solution. Surely that's better than either being negative or just sitting back and letting things drift?

No, what makes me cynical is having read stuff like this on our messageboard over a year ago when we had a decent team & still got shit crowds. Dropping the prices might have a short term advantage but the excuses will soon start again for some other reason. Also I seem to remember it took you a while for your crowds to get consistantly higher during the first few seasons of success.

As I can't say it wont increase to 3500, you can't say it will I'm not saying you'll be wrong and crowds won't increase if Pools use your figures. The problem is to get to a "break even" figure of the same amount as the 2600 then you need to increase the attendance by nearly 900.

People not going because mates aren't people who can't afford it, need to be attracted back. Some people who say £20 not worth it may well say £15 not worth it, as they will say they have seen games this season and the value isn't even there at £15.

As I don't know the attendance won't increase you AND MORE IMPORTANTLY Pools DON'T KNOW it will. Therefore surely they will look at making sure they will take as much as they can from a particular game. Just as any other business will ensure they get the best turnover possible from an event, regardless of what it is.

I'll ask you one question if they lower the price to £15 for any Saturday game and the attendance went up by 100-200 people, how do you suggest they get lost revenue back????

We and by that I mean everyone on here, every fan in a pub, and at games can discuss this, and as I said I not saying your wrong, just as I'm not saying I'm right, and we will all decide that there's a better way forward.

It's all trial and error, one step at a time to try to get the crowds back up.

I would say a possible way to try your £15 suggestion would be that the ticket only sold at that price if purchased between Mon-Fri of week leading to the game. But cost of £18 payable at the gate.

This helps Pools in that if they just reduce it to £15 on the gate and it a miserable day it probably wouldn't help the attendance figure, but if people want to save money then they buy ticket and still attend if miserable day, as pre bought tickets not reimbursable unless game postponed. And anyone who has purchased the cheaper ticket has done so knowing he/she can afford that price for the game, so if they don't go, they can't say I lost money I couldn't afford.

But if Pools did sell tickets at a cheaper price during the week , some would still find fault with it.

The fact Pools have done something and we're debating it, from all points of view can only help them come up with more ideas at a later date as I'm sure someone from the club with be reading this thread.

Of course it did but we got them. These people have recently been regulars you are talking about trying to entice people who have never been regulars you can't really compare the two situations. That's without even mentioning your ground ect.

If we were in the position you were last season we'd be getting 5,000+ that was proven when we were. You can't compare Pools to Darlo because when we are doing well I believe the Town will respond to a degree, Darlington has proved it won't.

Two different situations, two different towns.

For what its worth I think a lot of the criticisms are fair but it is good to see a toe being dipped in the water and getting people to commit to a few matches is something that seems to work for lots of clubs around Europe.

Two points to make though-

Clubs who do this usually include one "good" match in the batch of three or four. They call them gala matches here and prices are higher for them so getting a reduction for these is worth having.

They sell the offer pretty hard. Promotional stands in the hypermarkets, poster campaigns, first thing on website etc. It wouldn't be viable for Pools to do all of this but people won't rush to the club shop just because of a piece in The Mail, in a recession all businesses have to work on selling. Pools are run as a business and they are trying to improve the product but that is easier said than done in football. The sales side looks weak to me and it isn't being addressed at all.

Great point, the Leeds match is ideal. We couldn't sell it out last year when we still could have went down and it was Joel's last game so it's not going to be full. The more space available the more chance we have of having to share home areas with Leeds pondlife and the more chance we have of trouble again. I'd much rather see the ground full of families from Hartlepool supporting Pools.

But we aren't the problem it's the people who aren't going who are, we do pull together we all support the club through thick and thin. The ticket offer could be better thought out and could see more people through the gate supporting the club which is what everyone wants. I don't even want to compare our club to Darlo because as I said to Mr Loan Star their is no comparison. The club do a lot of things right but my only frustration is the over complication with such offers, I said to them in an e mail when they asked for feed back and I'm saying it now. What is wrong with selling cheaper kids tickets on the gate?

With good advertising I think that would get a better response, it's not about being negative or against the club it's knowing what people in this town are like!

why dont the club have a group of fans they can use to 'sound out' new ideas before they get aired publicly?

While only 2 or 3 people at Pools may have came up with the 'offer', its was picked to pieces by people on here who came up with 2 or 3 very valid points within an hour. This way, the club don't continually get hammered by some sections of its support and the fans will invariably have a say in what's a good idea and whats not.

Everyones a winner (apart from Darlo)!

Has that stopped? Has the family "feeling" disappeared? I used to take my kids because of the excellent season ticket offers for the young'uns ... and that's where the key to increasing crowds lie. The CK stand had a great family atmosphere full of fans of all ages. I'll always remember CT taking time out to talk to my boys before the game (what a real gentleman). Does this not happen any more?

As EAD said ... this is a good start. At least the club is thinking along the right lines at time when trading condtions are tough for all concerned.

.

Whats that got to do with anything the clubs not told us to speak for them. Time to say cheerio saying nothing else now bye I'm sure I won't be missed!

Serious question Phil, if thats your big fear then how can you get so much enjoyment and laugh so much at Darlos plight?

I feel sympathy for the loids because i know it could just have easily happened here if not for IOR, and could still happen. Just find it odd you can have that fear but revel in a similar club going the same way.

Anyway i dont want to hijack the thread so back on topic......like the others I hope it works but i cant see it making any difference whatsoever.

I dont take glee in it at all. Unlike others i simply dont arse lick the club and say everything is great. If the clubs fucks up il say so and if a player plays shite il say so.

Simples*


* i apoligise for using that word as i hate hearing people say it but it seemed quite apt.

This will come as no shock whatsoever, but I totally agree with you, Tree.

It's beyond me how people receive so much joy from the troubles of another club. Especially, when those troubles don't help Pools.

As i said earlier in the thread everyone on here has the best interest of Pools at heart, the fact we differ in opinions CAN ONLY in my opinion, BE BETTER FOR THE CLUB in the long term.

I don't think anyone on here is being ANTI just raising some good valid points so we can all get what we all want. And that is for the attendances to increase.

Maybe and just maybe the play off final came to early in our progress, fans were attracted in a short period of time, and the fact that we were relegated the season after being 8 minutes away from the 2nd tier of English football resulted in those people who had been attracted reverting back to the "Pools always blow it" conspiracy. Now if maybe we had consolidated even after that play off defeat and been established as a League 1 team for almost 7 seasons CONTINUALLY, then the apathy amongst those not attending may not have happened.

I'm not saying that's the case but just a possibility, I think most people on here can name fans who attended the Sunderland game , the play off final and even the first game against Leeds, but haven't been since. It's 3 seasons now for Leeds in our division, can anyone honestly say that we would not sell out against them last season, especially as someone has also pointed out it was Porter's last home game for us. Those 2 factors alone should have said we sold out.

Every post on here has raised valid points, points I hadn't thought about until they were pointed out, with everyone continuing to point out issues they think of, the club will get there. The best way forward is not to simply shoot down an idea simply because of the name of the poster, lets debate all valid points like adults, there not been much name calling, but if we get to the point were we discuss it without resorting to that then we can and will move forward as a club.

Think that's about all I can say on this thread, unless something else is raised that not been so far.

I have enjoyed reading all points and if someone from the club has, I'm sure they will raise them the next time they meet to come up with some sort of initiative to attract more fans.

I wish them luck.

it's a shame it is'nt aimed at kids a bit older,kids of that age have the attention span of a goldfish,the nephew who goes with me already has a season ticket the other nephew is twelve i would have probably bought him the tickets but he is to old

An observation, in the area of the ground I stand (Millhouse Terrace) I've noticed as the gates have fallen of late, quite a few of the fans age group 16-20yrs have gone missing. My interpretation on this is that many of that age are attending college or further education, unlike myself who was working at that age, they have very little disposable income.

What I'm trying to say is when I was 16/17 quite a lot of my friends were working/ in employment of some type, virtually all full time, I look at my eldest sons friends (18) and they are all at college, in fact non of them are working. I really do feel for the youth today, I expect a majority to have to leave the area to find any employment of real quality/quantity (thats not to say there is'nt good jobs around these parts), and that offer IMO is'nt going to attract many of them back.

Don't think I've called anyone that chip and I wouldn't cause I'm not like that.

but this offer isn't aimed at those people you mention, it is aimed at the under 10s. As Phil has said, there are other deals/offers/incentives for others on the way

I know it is'nt, where did I say it was?, and yeah my Lottery win is "on the way" also.

"and that offer IMO isn't going to attract many of them back" <-----------there

So are you saying that, for example my eldest (18) who is one "of them" could'nt take his youngest brother (9)- who does fall into the offer category, if he could be bothered to part with £15.

Plenty of opinions on here, and it's made for a good read.

One thing i will say is i agree with dibbs and chip, please dont tell anyone i said that.

It's great the club are doing offers but summit dead simple like 1 child goes free with a paying adult would have been just, if not more effective.

Or buy one ticket get the next half price.

Anyway, carry on...

on Saturday we'll struggle to get over 3 000 (on account of the shit weather and that no one's got any money after Christmas). The joined up thinking from this ticket "offer" is that no one in their right mind is going to let a child under 10 go to a football match on their own and therefore the parent will have to take them thus increasing the gate. What pools are neglecting to think about is the fact that this stay away parent would probably have to tell the kid in the first place , and by doing so he's probably already interested or going anyway and the child would probably have a kids season ticket in the first place! Looking at it from a kids point of view standing in the freezing cold for 2 hours is not much of am enticement. Convincing the child's mother that its a good idea for them to break their routine and go to football march on a school day could be a task in itself!

I know I've said it before and I'll say it again THE KIDS WE NEED THROUGH THE GATES ARE THE 11 -19 year olds... these are the ones we are losing are the minute.

When I ask kids why don't they go to pools they don't say its because it costs too much wonga.. (apologies for using a big fat damned bounders catchphrase) They say they don't go because its BORING.... yes the boring word rears its head again ..
What can we do to make it less boring well maybe they could start by entertaining us. Then maybe just maybe the missing fans will come back.

Lets face it they haven't done much entertaining since Neale Cooper left!

Nooooooo, PLEASE don't talk about the inflatable holiday thing as if you've accepted it has a right to exist. Surely it's an unmitigated, cringifying disaster that everyone wants rid of, not moved to where more people can see it?

It's AWFUL, ADG. If you could see it properly, you'd agree. I'd much rather watch the youngsters do their goal thing.

I know i've said it before but the pen competition died the moment they moved it out the big goals.

its wrong that they do them at the same time it takes the emphasis away from the kids its their big day the club should let them have their time then do the inflatable as a warm up to the penna's

I have it from a reliable source that you spend half-time queuing for food and drink round the back.

There is a lot of negativity in some of these posts and whilst there have been some good ideas mooted have these been mailed to the club?

I sent my ideas off to the club, some of which are quite viable (some of which in hindsight were downright foolish and impractical) and have received a postive response to them.

My impression of the incentive based at primary school children is that the club have in probably just over a week of publishing a plea for support, came up with this strategy, arranged for clearance to get into schools on a day that is a non-training day and delivered this package to the schools and then published the details on-line.

It's a small start, but a positive one and may not be everybody's cup of tea, but I am more than confident that other things are planned and also that the club are thinking of the bigger picture and maybe even planning for the future and considering also plans for what they can be implementing for next season too. If fans have mailed in in some number, then they will have plenty of ideas to consider and review. The crowds haven't dropped off over night, they've dropped off over a period of time and they WILL take a period of time to build back up.

As someone said in this thread earlier on one of the pages - there needs to be unity and togetherness and looking across the way to see how bad things are elsewhere. Cheap shots at the club and even tackier cheaper shots at individuals should cease - However that balloon holiday thing is pants

Postivity and togetherness please, one for all etc.

There's been some good points made on this thread.
So, is someone going to actually go to the club with some of the proposals or do we have to wait for someone from the club to read the board.
Come on, lets go to the club, advise what might bring the fans back and see what they say.
Can we appoint someone?

Sorry Col, forget my follow on post
I see you have raised some of the points on here with the club

beer is better mutley believe me

But you win a holiday at the end of the season with that competition can't be that bad think its the amount of time they have and the men needed to put it up that's why its there.

Theve tried cheerleaders before don't know what happened to them. Maybe it could be start again there are plenty of dance schools in the town. But how many things can you actually fit into 15 mins without it all been mashed together.

But this should be on a fresh thread if you want to talk about entertainment at games.

goals is best entertainment