The government is going to open the files in next few months about Hillsbrough, about time I think

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/8174312.stm

Obviously you want to know what went wrong at a disaster like this, so that you can take steps to try and make sure it doesn't happen again. But people seem to be saying that they can have peace of mind, and that their lost relatives and friends can 'rest in peace' , only when the facts come out.
But, when it's disclosed as it probably will be, that the police and the emergency services could have done things differently, what then?

The point is that there were lies about the whole thing from the relevant authorities. Then there's the disgraceful lies that the likes of The Sun and The Star printed immediately after the event, none of which were true and caused immense distress.

The fact no-one has accepted the blame (the FA, police etc) for the whole thing has lead to cases of mental illness for the families of the bereaved. Even 20 years on, it can't be put to rest until the truth is told.

I haven't even scratched the surface of the matter either.

I recently studied this disaster in depth for a criminology assignment. I got a very good mark for it too. Time for the truth I reckon.

It's always bothered me that all the blame was loaded onto the 'Authorities' regarding Hilsboro'.

For ever scousers have prided themselves that if they want to get into a game nothing will stop them. How many times did we see scousers climbing the walls of the old Wembley to get into cup finals.

No way am I saying that the police are blameless but it's never mentioned that the thousands that turned up without tickets to a game sold out weeks before have some responsibility as well.

Exactly.

I think Brian Clough mentioned something similar when asked about Hillsborough a few years after.

I take your point, Jish, but I think my point is more that, when tragedies happen, people involved will always look round for someone to blame and that, having found someone, the people feel better.
In truth the people who are blamed (unless they actually intended the disaster) very often didn't do anything that other people wouldn't have done in the same situation. It's just fate, almost, but people like to think that their lives can be controlled if only other people do their jobs properly (or whatever).

OK. Points taken from all. Maybe too many did turn up (which happens for ALL major events) but if the authorities did their jobs properly, it would never have happened.

I would urge you to think about what you are posting though. It seems some people just hate scousers. This was a disaster after all and innocent people were killed, amongst them young boys and girls were killed through no fault of their own.

The families would not campaign for 20 years for no reason. They just want to clear their loved ones names. Understandable, surely?

The planning was poor, the way the police reacted to the disaster was also poor and there are a lot of people with blood on their hands and that includes any Liverpool fan whe turned up that day and entered Hillsborough without a valid match ticket that day....

That's nothing to do with hating scousers just stating the obvious, but sadly some Liverpool fans haven't learned from hillsbrough as seen in their last Champions League final where they lost against milan....

I wasn't having a pop at anyone in particular about hating scousers, it was more of a pre-emptive strike before everyone started slagging them which wasn't the subject of the thread in the first place.

For big events, lots of fans turn up. Some without tickets. It has always happened and still happens today

this quote...
there are a lot of people with blood on their hands and that includes any Liverpool fan whe turned up that day and entered Hillsborough without a valid match ticket that day....
seems a bit harsh, but I understand the point you were trying to make about people being there when they shouldn't have been.

If anyone is actually interested in some cold hard facts on the case (some of which you will not have realised and may re-evaluate your views), have a look at http://downloads.hfdinfo.com/4HFDContext-n-Consequences.pdf. You might be able to understand why the families have been upset for so long.

Yes, but they don't end up with what happened at H'bro which was an extreme incident unlike any other.

And for what reason?

I'll read the reference.

Had a read of that and it reads out that they were lead as if lambs to the slaughter. Does anyone really think that was the whole story.

A glaring ommission was that there was no description of the scene outside the ground where the behaviour must have been worse than anybody had seen before from a football crowd to panic Duckenfield into opening the gate.

The politicians aren't going to admit that 10,000 scousers intent on getting into a football match can't be controlled are they.

There would be absolute hell on in Liverpool if they even suggested a thing...

yeah look at what happened with the sun, Liverpool is the only place I know of that a papers circulation must be close to zero, lot of places dont even sell it.

Well I can understand them boycotting the Sun as they took it to the extreme and a bit too close to the time...

I read that through that document and does seem very one sided.

It is probably, a combination of all the factors which caused the tradgedy.

Inadequate ground
Poor policing
Supporters without tickets.

We of that particular generation know what it was like to watch football in the 80's. You were treated badly by both Police and the clubs due to the perception that all fans were hooligans. Unfortunately the reputation of a lot of "fans" at the time was well deserved.

I feel very sorry for anyone who loses their life when all they wanted to do was watch a football game. Just like those poor souls at Bradford

i think the 'blame' can be well and truly shared out between all parties.