The Poolie Bunker

Chip, we all know that the high profile announcement on pools site is not for any reason other than to try and dissuade Leeds fans from getting tickets in the home end.

As for you calling this lad a 'spackard' get a fooking grip will you.

It's a long way to travel without seeing the game & any fan woudl have sympathies with fellow fans in that situation but you're saying that we should make it clear on our website that we should that the away allocation is limited. So tell me honestly, did YOU check our website to see if that was the case? I know I don't when travelling to away games - I check our website or speak to our ticket office. Surely all away sections are limited to a degree and if people assumed that they could just turn up on the day then they were taking a chance.

And?


Clearly, it wasn't expected to be a sell-out for Pools fans, because Pools didn't mention anything to the fans. Unless, of course, you're suggesting Norwich should know more about how many Pools fans will turn up than the club itself.


The Leeds game WILL sell-out for Leeds fans, and I'm sure Leeds fans will have got this information from the Leeds website.


I agree with them, because the onus is on the away club to their fans, especially when the home club have told the away club how it will be.

Whether it's common knowledge amongst home fans; away fans or anyone else is irrelevant. Exeter informed their fans. Why didn't Pools?

You wouldn't get that happening though, would you? And what exactly could they have done if the ground was full. I certainly wouldn't want Pools to recompense them because of a) a failure by their own club to inform them, or b) because they travelled despite being told it was all ticket.

My wife and I decided to go to Norwich.
The decision was made on Saturday morning.
We didn't have tickets for the match.
We went by train from Doncaster.
That's the background.

We arrived in Norwich at about twenty past one.
For some fortunate reason we decided to go to the ground to buy our tickets before going for a pre match slurp.
We purchased our tickets at about quarter to two. We were allocated two seats in the SECOND BACK ROW.
So there can't have been many left ( an assumption I know ).

If Norwich City are going to have this policy of a moveable away barrier, based on how many tickets the visiting club asks for, then that policy needs to be spelled out to the visiting club. The visiting club also need to be told that once the requested allocation are gone, then they are gone, and anyone turning up without a ticket will be succesful / unsuccessful on a first come first served basis.
This information then needs to be announced to the away fans through the communicating network of the visiting club
Some or all of that information has not reached Pools supporters.

Who is to blame ?????
Pools need to clarify to us on what basis we were allocated tickets and whether they were told that people who turned up on the day stood the risk of not being admitted.
Norwich City need to make the away end ticket only. Allow the visiting club to say lunchtime on the day before the game to sell their tickets, up to the maximum allowed, and then place their moveable barrier accordingly.
What is more simpler than that??????

That's exactly what I would do, but I have a bit of nouse.

Having read the comments from both sets of fans, I cant believe some Pools fans are trying to blame Norwich for the lock out. If they had decided on the day to restrict the amount of away fans then blaming Norwich would be understandable. However it seems HUFC knew fine well the situation with the limited capacity of the away end & they should have made it clear on the official site what the situation was. Those who were locked out need to take issue with their own club, not Norwich.

Well lets be honest - it wouldn't do any harm for Norwich to put it on their website - it MAY do some good.
But being equally honest again, I would wager that if we had put on our website that Hartlepool had opted for the 450 allocation there would still have been people locked out, because I doubt many of those that were locked out yesterday based their decision to just turn up on the day on the back of what they did/didn't see on our website.

Guys, I can assure you that you could have had up to 2000 tickets yesterday if you'd wanted them - on the provisao that Hartlepool paid for any unused tickets. It's our standard policy.
We can't afford to give you 2000 tickets and you sell less than that when we have people wanting to see the game - we're over £20m iin debt!

Which is exactly what you haven't done in blaming Norwich.

So the allocation is 2500, you sell 400, then Norwich have Saturday morning to somehow sell 2100 tickets to home fans? Oh yes, and the pools fans who turned up without tickets <em>still</em> would have been turned away. HUFC should have clearly warned you that tickets were very limited, and the tickets on the day would be first come, first served.
There are 19500 season ticket holders and tens of thousands of members at Norwich with an effective capacity of 25,500. The situation has to be managed to try to get as many people in as possible while still allowing a maximum 10% allocation to away teams if they want it. The club would lose 100,000s in gate revenue (and pies, drinks, programmes, etc) over a season if the full 2500 was left to away fans until the last minute.

Here is the official announcement on ticketing at Norwich, it certainly gives the impression that there would not be an issue.

Hmmm, one extra line of "We have opted for 450 tickets" might have saved a lot of hassle

I can understand the Pools fans Phil, theres nothing worse than being locked out after a long journey. However HUFC will have known the allocation was only going to be 450 so they should have made it perfectly clear that going without a ticket meant that gaining entry couldnt be guaranteed. Looking at the official website article they clearly havent stated that fact. Thats not Norwichs fault is it?

We don't know for certain yet that there was an allocation of 450. We will only find out if there is an announcement from Pools tomorrow.

Read it again my friend....my suggestion was that Norwich should make the away end all ticket, so if that was the case then people wouldn't turn up on the day without a ticket.
Secondly you wouldn't be getting the returns at the last minute, you would be getting them more than twenty four hours before kick off.
If you choose to have a moveable barrier then you must also accept the consequences of that choice. i.e last minute ( your words) returns.
Simply make the away allocation all ticket, as do other clubs. Surprisingly, you might find that this problem, which appears to happen on a regular basis at your ground, may just disappear.
IF Norwich had an away all ticket policy and IF Pools had asked for 450 tickets, chances are that Pools would have announced this, warning fans that travelling without a ticket was a no no.
I am surprised how difficult you are finding this suggestion.
I went yesterday thinking that paying on the gate would be a doddle, because I was under the impression that your away end had a capacity of over 2000. I had no idea that your club operated a moveable barrier policy.
I would assume that Norwich City passed this info on to Pools and if they did then Pools should have told us. However we don't know as yet if Norwich did explain that no more than 450 would be available. Pools may have assumed, as I did, that a further 1500 could pay on the gate.
Just make it an all ticket away end and the problem will go away, believe me.

As someone said earlier, you'd think common sense would prevail. 10 mins into the match someone at Norwich could have made the call and freed up a couple of extra rows of seats available in the ground to accomodate the obviously small number of Pools fans who could'nt get in.
I mean is there a set limit of empty seats you need to have between home and away supporters?. When we played Sunderland in the cup a few years back they accommodated some of our fans who turned up late by doing this, and that was in a derby with nearly 10k of our fans there ffs.

It'll be some Health and Safety dick on a high horse.

If Norwich fans had been locked out, it would have been there own fault, nobody elses. Every game at Norwich (in the League) is all-ticket and has been for years. The tickets available at the away section yesterday had been returned from Hartlepool and were being sold on a first come, first served basis. Your club should've warned you when they decided to only take 450 tickets.

We don't know that they did yet. We will only find out tomorrow assuming they make an announcement.

Yesterdays game wasn't all ticket, it was clearly stated on our website that you could pay on the gate if the game was all ticket for everyone clearly we wouldn't have had a problem.

The problem won't go away for the club if they're left paying for unused tickets.

I would have thought that if Pools only had an allocation of 450 tickets they would have mentioned it (get your tickets early, limited numbers -that sort of thing). Although results have been bad there would have been every chance of a decent number of our fans making the trip.

Why should Norwich be allowed to do that?

How the fook can any club say "bring 450 fans" or you owe US money!?

Surely that isn't on? fair enough if you've asked for more tickets but surely they can't charge on the minimum allocation??

I'm a bit sceptical about this minimum allocation business. Are we really being asked to accept that IOR would just succumb to another clubs demands for gate money that hadn't been received.
Are we being asked to believe that Norwich City could say buy this amount or that amount up to the maximum away support allocation.
Surely if Pools had been forced to take a minimum of 450 AND pay for them, then the least they would have done is tell us of this and urge us to buy them, thus not leaving the club out of pocket.
Surely.

Good point. What was the minimum allocation?

Norwich's own customer charter states;

"The Club will allocate a minimum of 2000 seats for Football League matches for away supporters unless it receives contrary instructions from the Police or Norfolk County Council Safety Advisory Group."

No mention of the other club, so in my eyes they have no right at all to charge a club for unsold tickets in an allocation of 2000 or below.

http://www.canaries.co.uk/page/Customer ... 55,00.html

It was all-ticket, as is every game. The pay on the gate were the remaining tickets sent back from Hartlepool. If you were under the impression the away end had a capacity of over 2000, whose fault is that? Do you really, really think that's Norwich's fault?

It's standard practice in the Championship. Norwich would lose 100,000s in revenue every season if we didn't do it, because every club would simply ask for the full allocation otherwise.

How can the game be all ticket, then on the other hand you talk about tickets being sold on the gate!?

Do you want me to highlight the obvious contradiction in bold for you?

It states on YOUR website the football league (no mention of the Championship) which you still play in by the way......

It is a good point. I think Tranmere had the minimum ever at about 150. I'm not saying the system is entirely fair, but it is understandable given that every game is a near sell-out.

If you pay on the gate then it isn't all-ticket then is it?

Considering the size of Norwich's ground I think it's reasonable to assume they would have had a decent sized away end. We can almost put 1000 in our small ground so no-one from here would have expected any problems. The fact is no-one knew Norwich adjust their away allocation from game to game so someone (possibly Pools - we wont know until they make an announcement who was to blame) should have let our fans know in advance.

Yes I do think it was Norwich's fault. Read your own charter. A minimum of 2000 away supporters it says. So if Pools had sold their allocation the balance up to 2000 should be available on the day.
If Norwich had reduced the away capacity on the day to 450, they should have announced that with the suitable endorsement from the Police or the council as they, according to your charter, are the only exceptions.
At the end of the day your club's grasping need for the maximum availale revenue supercedes their own charter. Shame on you.
Greed at the expense of travelling fans.

So in short your club aren't bothered about away supporters because they can make more money out of home fans, any seat empty in the away could be sold be a home fan.

Well that's great your club are maximising revenue.

But is it right? Your own customer charter states that away team for a football league match will get an allocation of 2,000, yesterday you failed to meet that promise. Do you think allocating a visiting team less than 1.7% of your stadium is on? It smacks of greed to me. Whether it is what always happens or not it doesn’t make it right and doesn’t make the way those people were treated yesterday any less disgraceful.

They are the tickets you returned unsold (you know, in the post from Hartlepool) being sold on the gate (to help your fans out, for heaven's sake!). Would you have preferred there to be 100 empty seats inside and 125 away fans outside?



We do, it takes 2500 (10%). But you have to request them. Again there are 19500 season ticket holders. There are then tens of thousands of members chasing 6000 tickets of which some must be allocated to the away teams. The maximum is 2500, but if the opposition has no chance of bringing anywhere near that why on earth shouldn't Norwich try to allow as many fans as possible to see the game. Everyone does this in the Championship and above, even clubs that get nowhere near selling out (and that is unfair).

Nice. I give up, Norwich should just give everyone 2500 and waste a million quid's worth of empty seats every season. Genius business plan.

[X] Stupidest comment of the entire thread.

IF THE GAME WAS ALL TICKET WHY WOULD 125 AWAY FANS BE STOOD OUTSIDE WITHOUT TICKETS THEY'D HAVE KNOWN THE GAME WAS FOOKING ALL TICKET THAT IS THE POINT!!?

Sorry for shouting but sometimes you have to!

They don't. Norwich fans know they'll need a ticket. If allocations are restricted, the club runs a ballot with priority groups, season ticket holders with 10 away stubs, then season ticket holders, then members, etc.

We weren't asking for 2500. We just wanted some clear information from somewhere that there would be a maximum allocation of 450.

This person can't see the moral issue here either, it's all about Norwich making money not people who've travelled hundreds of miles getting treat like shite.

THEY ARE THE TICKETS YOUR CLUB RETURNED FROM HARTLEPOOL. ALL-TICKET MEANS YOU NEED A TICKET. THAT'S ALL IT MEANS. THERE WERE TICKETS LEFT, SO THEY SOLD THEM ON THE TURNSTILE UNTIL THEY RAN OUT.
Jesus wept. Just read Waldo, he's the only one with an ounce of sense.

No - all-ticket means you buy your ticket in advance, not on the day. Otherwise what would be the point of announcing a game is all-ticket if you can just turn up anyway.

All ticket means you can't pay on the gate, yesterday you could.

Think about what you are saying if that is the case every single game in the World is 'all ticket!!?'

You aren't the brightest are you?

Well, yes, that's the issue. But should it have been Norwich's website or Hartlepool's that told you that?

Well your club seems to have given up on its charter, so it's no surprise you are giving up.
We all know why you do it..............that however doesn't make it right.
We all know why people in the financial sector did what they did but................... funnily enough they have been labelled greedy bastards as well.
I have never ever wished any club financial ruin but, having experienced first hand the greed of some of these so called big clubs, I am beginning to waiver.

Ok, so what you should do is set up a ticket booth 10 yards away from the turnstile. Then you can go there, but your ticket, then walk to the gate. Would that make it all-ticket? Or does all-ticket mean no tickets can be sold on the day?
But it's a non-sequitur anyway. What difference does the definition of all-ticket mean anyway: the ground was full. If I turned up to a ground without a ticket and found I couldn't get in, it would me my fault.

Jesus Christ this is hard work, how is he totally missing the point!?

If it was clear that the game was 'all ticket' for away fans yesterday nobody would have been turning at Carrow Road to purchase a ticket for an all ticket game they'd already have one!?

Is that clear enough?

I agree, it was the fan's faults (or possibly the HUFC website for not informing them of the potential problem). Thank you.

As thick as mince.

There are tens of thousands of members. There are also many other fans who aren't members or ST holders. There are 3500-5500 tickets available per game. There were many Norwich fans who couldn't go yesterday because the game was sold out to home fans. It's a problem, which is why the away allocation system is complicated. There would have been no problem, had your website or local press let you know.

Yes, yes you are. Or irrational anyway. Google "non-sequitur" (in the logical context, not the comical) so that you might understand your own "arguments" such as they are.