When the ball was played to Umerahs feet I thought he looked really good. Hamilton put himself about a bit when he came on and got in good positions. Sterry is still head and shoulders above this side.
Think that’s the only positives I could get from today. Walsall’s defence were far stronger and more organised than we were and their press worked a treat. Hopefully a better performance next Saturday and hopefully PH will thank the fans for their support and not run off down the tunnel.

Deffo take 3rd bottom.
Dissapointed when the Rumours of Mowbray n New Owners Dident take off.
Sings ST pitch of we going for promotion looks a bridge to far.
Stelling backing his quotes up as well.
Just a sky actor pretending he has an influence on better times for HUFC.
Only a game hey.
Results buisness always live in hope.

"That doesn't happen again as long as I'm the manager." He sounds shell-shocked and bitterly disappointed.

I think the key difference between Graeme Lee and Hartley is that Lee inherited a squad that knew how to play together.

Hartley has made a number of signings all of unproven quantity, some of those signings will be misses, some may be he hits, and few of his starting 11 have played competitively together before. He needs to quickly establish the players that are good enough from the ones that aren't.

I am just keeping my fingers that he's signed one or two decent players.

Anytime you change so many players in a team it's going to be a gamble, more so when most of them have no experience of league 2 football. Hopefully they can learn from their baptism in fire.

I only listened to the game on the radio so possibly I've been spared a full sense of how poor the performance was.

Still, people writing the obituary for the season on the strength of one really bad game!!

Stockport beaten at home, Swindon gone down 3-0 at Harrogate - early season results are full of surprises. Paul Hartley and co. have got a week to produce a much better performance at home to Wimbledon, and 10-15 games to show what they're really made of.

Like Hogans, I only got the feed from Tees, but it was clear from the commentary that, after the first 20 minutes we were second best in all departments.
I was surprised to see Ellis Taylor get a start & hope his inclusion isn't a condition of his loan agreement.
Sounded as if we were completely over run in midfield & couldn't get the ball out to Hastie or Taylor. Perhaps should have started with Crawford ? Some odd results - Stockport & Harrogate for example. Be interested to see how we line up for the home game next week. As always, we need to get behind the team. Nobody thrives on constant criticism.

Just got back, awful performance that got slightly better after Sterry and Hamilton came on. If we play like that the next few games I'll be seriously worried about the season ahead... hopefully things will improve.

Shocked he started Taylor, he's been with the club 2 days... thought they'd bleed him in a bit.

I thought the same, but it seems Joe Grey and Mika Ndjoli both picked up injuries so were out of contention along with Carver. Could have started with Hamilton though.

On the positive side we only conceded one more goal than Stockport

Doubt we'll finish a s high in the league as we did last season, and be one penalty save from our first ever Wembley appearance. In Raj we trust....
p.s. I know there's quite a lot of the season left yet !!!

Belated MOM to Killip stopped it being a rugby score.
This dosent mean hes decent far from it.

One of the great mysteries to me why we never brought a keeper in. Some may disagree, but it was a major requirement for me, disappointed it never happened.

We did goalkeeper/goal keeping coach dual role, Letheren was on the bench yesterday.

At least Stockport got beat

Does anyone know :

1) When we last got beat by 4 goals on the first day of the season?
2) Where we finished in the league that season?

Yes, 1989. We would then go onto pick up just 9 points from the first 19 games.

In December time, Cyril Knowles took us over and guided us to 19th, which saw an heroic turnaround.

We also lost 5 nil during Neale Cooper's 2nd stint during a league cup game, which was played before the first league game. We finished 23rd that season.

My gut feeling (without the stats to back this up) is that managers who lose by 4 or more goals on the first match of the season tend to struggle to turn our fortunes around and end up leaving within a few months!

What an unmitigated disaster that season was - and ironically the last time we had Scottish managers in charge - Neale and John Hughes. We got some right tonkings that year - a couple more 5-0s and a 6-1. Pretty sure Yogi could have turned it around if he'd been given proper backing.

To be honest, we played a lot better during the 5 nil to Crewe than we did against Walsall. From memory, we had more chances, more shots and I remember leaving gobsmacked at the score line, Crewe were clinical that day. Yesterday, the score flattered us and if Walsall had of been as clinical as Crewe were, we'd have lost 12 nil.

The score was regrettable, but that aside what’s all this about starting of with a 4-0 defeat means a bad season because it happened before and that was a bad season.
What nonsense, are we living in the Middle Ages? How th3 hell can there be any possible co-relation between the two, that’s superstition and fairy tales.
We got tanked, it was bad, but that means nothing in relation to anything.

snowy.."We got tanked, it was bad, but that means nothing in relation to anything."

...no ..but if you are the "type" who thinks the scottish premiership and championship are northern league standard .."dog and duck leagues"...and that any jock players from those leagues signed by hartley are a major "gamble" and "unknowns" and very likely to be well below efl league two standard ...and if you are one those types who think the st mirren friendly being cancelled was super significant ...or that the lack of a SQUAD photo 6 weeks before the season kicks off is somehow indicative of impending catastrophe..together with bookies making us relegation favourites...then even though its the first game of the season and it is only one game ...for them the fact that we were tanked is clear unquestionable evidence that we are well and truly goosed...the season is over and may as well be cancelled..."deffo take third bottom"..my guess would be that these types who from my experience tend to congregate in the mill house stand will all be their usual hyper negative toxic selves come next saturday...any player who makes a mistake will no doubt get the standard abusive treatment for the rest of the game..the players ethnic origin may well come into it...and if god forbid we lose the match i guarantee they will all be calling for hartley and his sweaty sock lads to be shipped back home over the border pronto... there may even be a ritual involving the burning of the scotland national flag ...who knows?.. wouldn't surprise me ...and of course the chairman will then inevitably be accused of the usual on here by these knuckle draggers...that's a given.."shirt n tie burglary".."cheap option".."bottom half playing budget"..just cant wait tbh like..

Ya fucken sad bastad.
Get a life.

Can we have a new colour.
Getting bored of that red one.

No problem, right …. now what’s your favourite colour in your BIG colouring book?
Y’know, the one with all the fairy tales in like…… ‘Mr Mouse’s Furry Friend heard a Rumour’ or even ….’Relegation Rabbit’s in a Stew’.

gloves..."Ya fucken sad bastad"

..such illiterate eloquence...once a yob always a yob..

people get so worked up about the first game of the season with expectations higher or lower than they should be. if this result has happened mid season i doubt it would have bothered many and there is a good chance that all the teams who suffered a bad result on saturday will end up higher in the league than those teams that beat them. an early blip is fine as long as after 10 games these blips do not become the norm.

This team we have brought in was a massive gamble. To lose 4 nil first game is bound to set panic amongst some. If fans aren't concerned after that they have there heads burried in the sand.

billy.."This team we have brought in was a massive gamble.To lose 4 nil first game is bound to set panic amongst some"

..too right....and bet you cant wait to pour some oil on the fires, lead the mob and link it all back to the monster who saved our club...predictable...looks like the circus is coming back to the town...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLvGnro4Cgw

If it is a massive gamble maybe you should treat it as such. It could be a winning gamble or a losing gamble or even somewhere in between.
Only time will tell.
That result on Saturday has various consequences.
It could galvanise the players into resolving that they're going to move mountains to prevent too many ( if any ) repeats of that result.
It could cause them to think (like you appear to do) "maybe we're just not good enough"
It could signal more is needed etc etc etc etc.
We've had one result, there are a further 45 chances to get it right.
One thing you don't have to gamble on is that if PH and his "gambles", as you called them, don't get it right, then Raj will act. You can call that scenario a dead cert.

Do you not feel bringing in half a team from Scotland is not a gamble? We're you happy with the performance on Saturday. Take it you were?

It could well be a winning gamble. But I would think alarm bells are ringing in the managers head after that performance.

Raj will certainly act like he said over lee the fans will turn on me if I didn't get rid. He ain't stupid.

You've toned it down a bit, Mr Billy. You've gone from a massive gamble to a gamble.
Of course it's a gamble, any signing can have that tag attached to it. It could also be classed as a calculated risk.
However, like all gambles, it can succeed or it can fail. So far it has done neither. Some will already have the gamble as a disaster, some as not a failure...yet and some as undecided. What that screams out is time will tell. That's where it is at this moment in time.

To keep the fans though at a good level of support we need a decent performance Saturday, no excuses.

billy..."Do you not feel bringing in half a team from Scotland is not a gamble? We're you happy with the performance on Saturday. Take it you were?"

1..signing any player is a gamble...with efl experience or not...you appear to think scottish league experience makes it a bigger gamble..i dont..especially when the players involved have been signed by a scottish manager with a proven track record of success.. who knows the players ,has seen them play had them checked out and is confident the gamble will come off..as hartley said.."i know what i'm doing"..they're all "just footballers" wherever they've been playing..

2...wasn't there on saturday and have only listened on the radio and taken in the extended ifollow highlights..was i happy with the performance?..are you serious?..4-0..yeah chuffed to bits...but unlike you i don't see it as indicative necessarily of any gamble failing with our new scottish or english contingent..managers and players...and i certainly dont see it as evidence of 3rd bottom or relegation at the season end...or see it as evidence of the chairman having yet again f/ked up lied and cheated as you invariably do whatever the issue...

Signing players from the Scottish Championship is a bigger gamble for me than signing proven EFL players. I don’t know how anyone could argue otherwise. We’ve seen Donnelly, Peter Hartley and Kebamba and others all sign for SPL teams and they weren’t top players for us. My mate was at Kilmarnock v Dundee Utd on Saturday and said Alan Power was Kilmarnock’s captain. He was crap in England. We have signed players from a worse league than the SPL so it is a huge gamble in my opinion. We just have to hope that the players are the best from that league and will quickly adapt.

I don’t think we can blame Raj if it doesn’t work out because Hartley has 100% chosen these players before looking in the English leagues. This may be controversial but I believe that most of us know League 2 players better than Hartley does and know what is needed. We’ve only signed one player from League 2 and that is worrying. Again though, it’s been one game and so we’ve got lots of time for the players to get used to it so nobody should be going mental just yet.

When Lee took over I was shocked. His first interview confirmed my worst fears, I learnt nothing from it or subsequent interviews and his general behaviour during them made me feel he really wasn’t interested at all in getting any sort of message across. He inherited a settled team and made additions.
……. but never did I criticise or come on here demanding he do this and that, but when the inexcusable rudderless end of season set in that was it for me and time to ‘open fire’.
I’ll pay Hartley the same compliment because he’s chalk and cheese when compared with Lee.

Yes totally agree I'm not sure some will grasp the point about the standard of Scottish football though. Obviously there will be gems in there but when Motherwell played in the premier league they had 3 ex poolie and 2 ex darlos, shows you the standard up there.

It’s a massive gamble signing players on free transfers or for next to nowt, obviously their previous clubs thought they weren’t up to it. Things can change, Rees Oates, glad to get rid of him the first time round yet was responsible for getting us out of the N.L. when came back.

You say we know league 2 players, you’re right, but he’s just doing exactly the same thing, signing what to him are known quantities.

Ah that's different and keeping the fans happy is a priority that can't be ignored. Some fans will be happy with a decent performance and some will be happier with a 1-0 scrappy win.
Points on the board are the priority in order to get us up the table. It will be interesting to see how Walsall fare over the first ten games.
Fifty points is the target for me, anything more is a bonus and the quicker we get to fifty the bigger the chances are of a decent if not perfect bonus.
We still need two or three more players IMO.
As usual injuries and suspensions will play a big part and more crucial with the squad restrictions and closed windows.

porter.."Signing players from the Scottish Championship is a bigger gamble for me than signing proven EFL players. I don’t know how anyone could argue otherwise"

..you are entitled to your opinion of course but have to disagree with you there mate..you think the scottish premiership or championship compares unfavourably in terms of quality to efl league 2?...and you base this on peter hartley and kabamba having had a few games for motherwell....fine if that's your "logic"...you also forgot to mention john daly who did the same...oh and trevor carson too..oh and jack baldwin as well..all of them crap yeah and plying their trade in the top 2 tiers of scottish football..it must mean standards up there are worse than our league 2 level...err ok...but aren't you the bloke who was comparing odusina to rio ferdinand a while back?

billy..."Motherwell played in the premier league they had 3 ex poolie and 2 ex darlos, shows you the standard up there."

...if your analysis is that simple yeah of course you are right pal...but how many ex premiership and efl championship or league one players are playing in the top two scottish leagues at present?..have a think...

It’s all opinions so none of us are right at the moment and I really hope I’m wrong. Poolie1 though, you have kind of backed up my point, I was meaning League 2 must be similar standard to the SPL for our former players to play in it. We have signed players from lower than the SPL though. If a player left us and went to Hamilton or Inverness in the Scottish Championship you would say it was a step down, wouldn’t you?
I still maintain Odisina is class and was a League 2 equivalent of Rio in the way he played.

billy.."Motherwell played in the premier league they had 3 ex poolie and 2 ex darlos, shows you the standard up there."

..suggest you read... and break the habit of a lifetime and as i say think...life's just not that simple when you think about it a bit like...and dont be fooled by snobbery..reckon these lads may know a bit more about it than you do..

"That’s been the general stigma since I started. You’ve got to shut your brain off to the country when you’re scouting but there’s a lot of people in this industry who just go, “Scotland is poor. I won’t bother.” There’s as much snobbery about watching a top player at Sunderland (in England’s third tier) as St Mirren (of the Premiership), though. It’s subjective bias from people who are in jobs that don’t want to take a perceived risk as, if they get it wrong, they might get their P45."

https://theathletic.com/3346810/2022/06 ... transfers/

porter.."I was meaning League 2 must be similar standard to the SPL for our former players to play in it."

so..ffs...if we sign a few players from national league or premier league one north.. and they play a few games for us and do ok ..does that mean the overall quality and standards of football in league 2 must be on the same level as the lower leagues that those players used to play in?..they are if that's the simplicity of your logic pal...

porter.."I still maintain Odisina is class"

..ok...that doesn't surprise me...but think you're in for a shock this season mate..

Just done a quick Google and found that Hartley and Donnelly have both coincidentally played 53 games in Scotland and Kabamba played 42 so it’s more than a few games.
We won’t agree on this so I’ll leave it now but it’s good to debate it without daft name calling so I look forward to the next discussion.

Can we just get behind the team and manager.
We’re all in a lifeboat together, so maybe it’s time to do our job and encourage and support our team. End of ….. Amen ….. etc.