Does anyone know if there is a way to find out how to compare actual minutes on the pitch between Bobby Moore and David Beckham playing for England. Is it fair to compare both players, as I recall DB recently came on for 3 minutes, does it count if a player is one the bench and does not get a game?

you can only get a cap if you play. Even if it is for 3 mins. Dont be fooled into thinking that because beckham has more caps, he is thought of as a better player than moore

Maybe we should do a Gaelic football kind of thing: three points for a selection and one for a sub.

Moore played 108 games for England, he started them all , he finished them all, including any extra time games, World Cup Final 1966, World Cup quarter final defeat against West Germany 1970 to name 2 .

Minute for minute then, Moore played for longer for England than Beckham.

He also captained the England team 90 times out of those 108, caps.

He captained England at the age 0f 22 on his 12th cap.Becoming the youngest ever England captain at the time, a record that still exists if I'm right.

Moore was first footballer to win the BBC sports personality of the year in 1966

Yeah but what else did he do besides that, eh?

The one thing he didnt do funnily enough was play in the 1-1 draw with Poland in 1973 which saw England elimanated from the 1974 World Cup, just maybe that was the difference. Though he had been caught by Lubanski in the game at Poland which we lost 2-0. But reckon we may have got the win we needed at Wembley if he played.

And he almost signed for Tottenham, and missed the 1966 World cup due to his contract expiring and if he hadnt signed quickly for West ham again he would have been ineligible to play in the World Cup Finals of 1966.

Beckham isn't fit to be mentioned in the same breath

Beckham is the ultimate self publicist, a product of our celebrity obsessed society ... and he's now reaping the reward, but it's counts for jack shit in my eyes, a flawed statistic that I can't respect or take seriously.

Strange all the stick Beckham gets.

For me he's an incredibly good pro, and as a person a pretty good example to youngsters, when has he ever courted real controversy in his career?

Plus he gets a game for AC Milan, are people honestly going to suggest he isn't good enough to be involved with an England squad? He's deserved every cap in my book.

I concur. I wish our players would play with half much committment, heart and passion as Beckham displays in each and every game.

He's had his day and it's gone... he just can't leave the stage ... and he does boost shirt sales dramatically when he signs for one of his new clubs....

Strange, the last few times a watched him play for England he's performed as well as he has for years. You can't kid people, if he wasn't good enough to be wearing an England shirt he'd know it, for example Downing got booed again on Saturday in an England shirt. Fabio Capello is no mug I can assure you, he's picking him.

He has the money, but what is vital that his biggest hunger is for football. Just look at the condition he's in at the moment just look at the level he's playing at.

We have a strange mentality in this country, we all want to knock people down. I think their is plenty to admire about David Beckham.

does he remind us of anyone at Pools?

Well Mr I has just defended him so, no not at all!!

He's the Richie Rich of England, a nice presentable face for the TV, model pro, never rocks the boat and always says the right thing ... and their best years are behind them... I'm just surprised you missed the similarity.

Whether he's fantastic or shite is not the issue here. Gazza was fantastic for England but didn't break any appearance records; so what?
It's unfair to compare cameo appearances with full games. If you're a sub, even if you come on in the first minute, you weren't first choice; you're not the automatic choice that Mr Moore was for so many games.
And anyway Beckham hasn't been caught shoplifting yet.

I have been a big fan of Becks throughout his career but it's time to move on surely.

I was at the match on saturday and what I found really embarrassing was all the photographs people were taking and the cheers for him every time he picked his nose/scratched his balls etc etc and that was in the warm up.............Pathetic.

But isn't the point the fact he came on and played to a very high standard?

Surely that is the bottom line, that is why he is in the England squad because he is still playing well.

I can't see what we achieved by seeing Becks playing in a friendly though. Arran Lennon looked lost in the first half but the game was won after the first goal went in so we would have been better off giving him a full 90 mins.

What was acheived was that we won a football match 4-0, surely ultimately that is what you are trying to achieve every time you play.

It was a warm up for Wednesday night, Beckham has a role to play on Wednesday night against Ukraine. It wasn't a pointless friendly like we had under the likes of Sven and Steve the Dutchman, it's about having a settled team were all the players are fully aware of their role within that.

You watch Moore play and then watch Beckham play. Moore was Sunday league compared to Beckham. He's one of these people who's legend has far exceeded reality, if he was young today he'd be playing in the championship.

Yes but all his caps were proper ones. Size 6 7/8.

.... those two sentences beggar belief.

Sorry Mr Snow, they were completely different animals and I'd have Beckham over Moore every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

Based on what? one tackle in Mexico?

The rest of the time he played against mostly poor teams. Football was pretty much an amatuer game across the world give or take a dozen countries. Try watching a game from that era now and compare it against the speed of modern day football.

Mind you, maybe Eric Liddle would win in a modern day olympics 400m too.

tell me about your experience of watching bobby Moore play.

truth is, nobody will ever know how good they would be in todays game, its all conjecture

Whats Harry Enfield got to do with it?

I think Hungary and Puskas exploded that theory in 1956.

You're not comparing like for like between games played 30 or 40 years ago and now but at his peak Bobby Moore was a great footy player, no panic, no emotions, just did his job very, very, well.

Til that Polish fellar ran past him and scored that goal which knocked us out of the world cup.

This was a similar argument to the one I had with my two uncles earlier on in the year. They are some on the "old hat" pools fans who never go now but did during the time of watty moore etc in the 50-60, and now for some reason love it when we loose. They were saying that the team of the 50's would beat our team now, I said it would probably be a good game till half time then the modern day team would run rings round them as fitness kicked in. They laughed at me and called me stupid I argued that the current team of the last ten years were the most successfull we ever had, they couldnt see my point and just shouted me down.

I also said that the current man u team would wipe the floor with the busby babes and they called me an idiot for that as well.

You see you can only play against people put infront of you and all this talk cannot be proved and only an opinion, like we will never see dixie deans record broke due to the fact he was playing teams all with goalies like ALB week in week out.

Bobby would ave never had his neck tattooed .

While I would agree with your points, I was wondeing if the current Man U team played the Busby Babes using the laws as they stood in the 50s, would the current fannies that parade as footballers be able to handle a bit of physical play?

While I would agree with your points, I was wondeing if the current Man U team played the Busby Babes using the laws as they stood in the 50s, would the current fannies that parade as footballers be able to handle a bit of physical play?[/quote]

Very Good Point. I'm just imagining Ronaldo showboating with his back to an uncompromising Centre Half.

Have to say ronaldo, tevez and rooney would make them all look a bit stupid so much so they would probably get kicked up in the air, but cream always rises to the top

It's a non-argument really and it applies to all sports.

If the players those days went through the same fitness training as today's and had the benefit of today's coaching know-how, they'd probably be more than capable of matching them. They were the best of their day.
Or if Roger Bannister could rewind his life 55 years and train in today's environment, he wouldn't be going for the first 4-minute mile he'd be going for the first 3-and-a-half minute mile.

Talent isn't genetically evolutive. Those comparisons are completely pointless.

I agree, every generation has people with great talent they will prosper in the environment they find themselves in.

Can you imagine Ronaldo doing his step overs confronted by Norman Hunter whilst playing on a 1970's bog for example!? On the other hand can you imagine both sides playing on a carpet whilst being officiated by a modern day ref!? Any comparison is impossible the eras are so different.

Peoples God given ability doesn't evolve, the sports themselves do.

Ey Sussy, thats the first time I've ever agreed with you.

you can't compare them... Beckham will NEVER achieve what Bobby Moore did...



But Beckham IS cut from very similar cloth

PS I only wish I could remember the 1966 clip happening rather than just seeing the pictures!!

In the sixties boxers would fight on till there eyeballs were hanging out ..

And thats why they all ended up brainless morons, boxing has moved on for the better in that respect, ie with cuts and stopping fights when clearly one party is getting his head smashed in.