Filming has just started on ex-Hartlepools manager Brian Clough's 44-day disaster as Leeds manager.

Hope they incorporate his role at Hartlepool in some way during the film.

Saw one scene being filmed where Clough shows his skillz on the training ground before doing a Peter 'Ave It' Kay kick off camera.

Now, not being pedantic here but seeing as Clough's knee was critically injured at Boro, the injury which forced him to stop playing and become the League's youngest ever manager at Pools, I don't think he'd be able to do that somehow.

The lad playing him looks more like David O'Leary.

This is our man:



Michael Sheen as Tony Blair in The Queen

It was a cruciate wasn't it?? Now it would mean six or nine months out but then they didn't have the surgical techniques and so they just let it heal out of place. It'd kill his mobility but he could still boot a ball with later aches.

If they didn't have the surgical techniques back then, how could it be fixed - and how could Cloughie do such a thing like that.

The answer realistically is that he couldn't !

Aye, at Roker Park- you took the words out of my mouth!

Sorry, Mutley, I stand totally corrected. You're absolutely right.

Nobody ever mentioned though that Clough was at Sunderland as well ?

They used Chesterfields ground to film some scenes of the film as it looks like it's still in the 70's

Probably the greatest manager Hartlepools United ever had - we should name the Rink End after him if at least we don't want a statue.

And I don't just say that because of the name Brian Clough.

From this little club struggling in the 60s a EUROPEAN CUP WINNER was born !!!!!!!!

Ask Chip, he has probably had every serious proffessional football injury going.

Ah, but then he would have never have come to Pools, would he, Mutley ?

Pools have only had one manager worthy of naming a stand after, and it's already been done!

Why can't we do it again, I ask in all politeness ?

Clough didn't do as much as Sir Cyril at Pools, IMHO, apart from the odd mention of fat goalies and driving buses after he left in his many books

You would never name a stand after anyone with the personality of Clough surely. A brewery or a toilet block yes but a stand never.

Must have been a top player though young Clough. Didn't he need Taylor to perform as a manager?

Ehhhh I don' know WLWH, First Dario Gradi, now Clough, have you been sucking lemons all week?

Cloughie knew Leeds was a poison chalice and to be fair, apart from one season under Sgt Wilko, you have been piss poor (compared with the teams you wanted to be as successful as) ever since

Leeds Utd, always the bridesmaid, never the bride

You're spot on about LUFC talbot - always the bridesmaids but still top totty. Obviously the Gradi thing's a bit tongue in cheek and yet I can't help thinking it's all got a bit over the top. And I acknowledge he was a top manager compared with his peers but if he was so good why was he never snapped up by the big boys. You have to wonder! But Clough - nah. A nasty piece of work. Had he brought Taylor with him to ER maybe he would have tackled things a bit differently and then who knows. As it is both he and we probably lost out. Still if beating Malmo is your thing then he's the best. But the book is a poor imo - I think the author, like all the rest, is a Leeds hater (Terrier I think from memory)

I don't agree with the Malmo thing, a team the size of Forest winning the 'real' European Cup is no mean feat and I am sure you wouldn't have been too bothered if Leeds had done the very same!

Agree about the book though, hard to follow and generally shite!

PS

I'm sure the bunker literary police will be round to sort me out for that last comment!

Forest's achievements (twice) were immense but luck plays a part in cup competitions. The Clough 'urinal' still has the right kind of ring to it for me though. Had he won the FA Cup he may have been worthy like all the truly great managers.

As far as never getting snapped up by the 'big boys', isn't it just an indication of how shite the Premiership and Championship are

It seems to be a constant merry-go-round of the same names who are constantly lined up for the same jobs

Megson, Robson, Atkinson, O'Leary to name but a few

Clubs seem very reluctant to take a gamble on decent lower league managers, Gary Johnson for instance

O"Leary is the worst thing to happen to LUFC - worse than Ridsdale.

Johnson is a good shout. Ince is about to get the call though although I wonder if he had no big clubs behind him as a player would the call have come so quickly (if at all). Ince, like Robson, is a 'name'. Johnson is the ex Latvian manager with a bit of previous at Cambridge. He deserves his chance though. Pleased to see him go (if he does). We can hardly do with MK Dons playing a blinder in Div 1. The new clubs/clubs with new grounds/fresh starts under new owners seem to be the one's with momentum these days.

I have exactly the same thoughts about Ince, if he hadn't played for Man Ure........, but fair play to him,he did start at the bottom, but this move could have come just a little bit too soon.

I hope Ince succeeds should he appear in cotton country. Rovers are a club punching above their weight, well managed, which could quickly find themselves on the slide. Wouldn't want to see that.

I refer the honourable gentleman to my post in the other thread...

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=16310

I remember suggesting to the late Paul Mullen (must have been at least 10 years ago I think) that the club should invite Cloughie to a Pools game so we could pay our respects etc. He said they already had approached him a few times but he didn't seem interested for whatever reason. Pity though, he would've got a very warm welcome I'm sure...

I agree its just a shame he never got a chance at it, but it seems even to this day you still have to be a bit of a yes man to manage england.

In the case of Cloughie, we were only ever a step on the ladder so to speak, so let's not kid ourselves. However, for anyone to dismiss his achievements in the game would be churlish..... Cloughie was never gonna rise to the highest levels of the game in this country because he terrified the adminisitrators, the blazer wearing rule book writers..... we all know the sort they like.

Cloughie didn't have what it takes to manage England. He built his teams around 'yes men' - McGovern/O'Hare etc. He seemed to have problems with big name players. Nah, he was at his best with clubs with low expectations and where he was undoubtedly the biggest fish in the pond. Anyway a drunken England manager surely was out of the question . . . .

Something tells me you didn't like Clough

And of course the incomparable Donald Revie didn't have yes men, did he, Billy Bremmner anyone??

I don't underestimate his achievements simply point out:

a) he didn't seem a particularly nice bloke or someone to represent England at great occasions
b) he got it wrong at ER (his only really big job )
c) he seemed better when Taylor was around to curb his worst excesses
d) he appeared to need a few 'yes men' on the pitch whilst playing the maverick himself which is a bit duplicitous. Bremner a right little yes man for sure - Giles would have been the worst mindst, and big Jack.

There were/are better managers for me - that's all.

I don't think Cloughie would have done a runner to Saudi Arabia for money when the going got tough though...

I don't think Cloughie could run anywhere other than the bog at the end mate. FA were scheming behind Revie's back so he left 'em to it. They did the same to Sven who never failed to qualify for goodness sake . . . . But this wasn't about Leeds or Revie it was about Clough and the memorial stand. Revie has his stand and I sit in it with pride every other week. Does Clough deserve one in the NE? I doubt it. As I say the Clough memorial urinal would be a fitting tribute to a man whose ego knew no bounds, whose liver knew no peace and whose mate (taylor) appeared to know enough to move on.

He didn't do too badly though, even if he was an alcoholic egomaniac - as MadJohn said earlier...

Don't forget though, Leeds are the REAL Champions of Europe, aren't they......

As far as I'm concerned anyone who doesn't appreciate Brian Clough's qualties is quite simply in a state of denial.

"I don't underestimate his achievements simply point out etc"


Agreed

I wouldn't call Dave Mackay, Kenny Burns, Colin Todd, Gary Birtles, Stuart Pearce, John Robertson, Martin O'Neil, Larry Lloyd, Trevor Francis, Kevin Hector, Tony Woodcock, Roy Keane, Frank Clark and a few more I could mention, a bunch of yes men as such. All footballers have to abide by the manager's decisions. What about Don Revie getting all the Leeds players to say yes to a game of bingo every day!!
Clough did one or two acts at Pools which were above and beyond the call of duty, like rattling a tin under people's noses in order to help keep Pools afloat.
As for the man not being able to kick a football after his injury..........he did make a come back and played three matches in the top flight, which were his only three I believe. He packed it all in on the advice of the medical people who feared he could end up crippled. He could still leather a football.
Interestingly both he and Revie were born in Smoggieborough. Cloughie liked a drink but stayed fit long after he retired. He was an avid squash player as well as a decent cricketer.
Personally I never liked Revie, he couldn't lace Cloughie's boots. Cloughie was too much of a loose cannon to get the England job. Now the FA DO like yes men, although I don't think this current England manager falls into that category. Maybe they are learning.
There is a stand at Forest named after the man and a road between Nottingham and Derby, they are appropriate.

If Cloughie was England manager and won things, he could surround himself with as many 'yes men' as he liked.... Cloughie proved that a team in the true sense doesn't need any big names in it...

Clough = 2 European Cup wins
Revie = 0 European Cup wins (and Revie wasn't manager in 1975 when they "Lost" to Bayern Munich when they "won" the thing, ahem).

No big names in Clough's team - Shilton and Francis anyone? Record transfer fees for the pair of 'em in all probablity.

No point in a Clough 'v' Revie debate though. Open minds are required and in my experience are very hard to find in any discussion about LUFC/Revie. But didn't Clough leave Forest in a hole from which they have yet to recover whilst Revie left LUFC on their way to the European Cup Final? And didn't Clough tell the world that Frank Clark would be a top manager (Revie recommended Giles and proved to be correct as he built Atkinson's great WBA side for him)! Strange how Clough fell for the hapless Clark rather than O'Neil. Suggests there was room for only one star in Clough's life I would suggest. All the evidence infact suggests he wasn't a particularly nice bloke who was eaten by his own personality and therefore unworthy of a stand (which was my only point) but a relatively successful manager of that there can be no doubt.

Uncle Bob Paisley, a canny lad, had both of them on the mantlepiece.

Why don't you just cut to the chase. Cloughie came to Leeds, told a few home truths and the fans have had the sulks ever since.

Cloughie fluffed his one and only chance at a big job that's true enough.

I think Winning TWO European Cups was a massive job!!!!

And you can't win the REAL European Cup when it was a PROPER Competition TWICE by luck!!!!

By dismissing Cloughie Leeds United fluffed their big chance of becoming a big club.