I feel we should all refuse to speak to any call centre not in the UK..If that's being racist I don't give a flying fook.. Its about time we stopped these greedy profiteering bastads

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for a company to announce record profits, pay huge bonuses to fat cat execs, put prices up, then sack 1,400 staff just before christmas, then move all call centres to india... its fookin disgusting.

At the mo all the staff in npower are just sat about waiting for the announcement.

npower oot!

I think Peterlee just took on a load of new staff there a couple of weeks back.

It is disgusting and downright greedy - at a time of austerity for most people the big six energy companies, nPower being one of them, have saw a five-fold increase in their returns in the last four years. Then they pull a stunt like this - paying people off just before Christmas so they can move operations to India, provide an inferior service, and increase their returns even more!

The smiling face of the 'free-market'.

My sister works there, Merry fooking Christmas.

My contract with Npower is almost up. I don't care if they're the cheapest they can fuck off because they are not getting a penny from me after January.

To be honest if I could live without any of the bastards I would.

Her job is safe at Peterlee just found out.

See. Even call centres in Calcutta would rather not deal with peterlee.

Their have been constant complaints about the language barrier and the accent being difficult to understand so they have decided to move to India.

The mrs job is safe too, moving to houghton in feb mind.

Hope mr billog in thornaby has had the same good news.

corporate companies like them are the realm of the nazis, and ran by not nice people who attend secret ethnic cleansing meetings with a picture of the Fuhrer in the background

The whole country feels totally hopeless and grim these days. If you've got a job, it might go any minute and, for many people, their working wage isn't high enough to comfortable cover necessities never mind the odd pleasure.

Then, to cap it all, if you become unemployed, you have to attend regular meetings at your Job Centre to be humiliated by bonkers exercises which you have to take part in, to 'help' you find a job. Of course there are no jobs. If there were,you would just apply for one and get it without needing the bonkers exercises. God, I wouldn't like to be young these days.

You have to feel sorry for poor Mr Massara the npower Chief Exec who has no option other than to transfer jobs to India so, according to the BBC business news, he can raise profit margins on the retail business from 3 to 5%. This is the same Chief Exec who refused to forgo his £150k bonus despite rising energy prices. Its a shame they don't transfer directors jobs to India, they could save even more money that way.

They're absolute greedy corporate not nice people .Nice of him to blame us for the decision to move these jobs to India.. How about we all sack off him and his GERMAN owned company.. These big 6 need a bloody nose it's about time us gullible twats gave him one...

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The companies are only doing what they are supposed to, ie working for the benefit if their shareholders.
Rather than dismissing them as greedy not nice people people need to find a way to change the game, the government needs to be more proactive also

There are only 2 ways you can change things

1. The government steps in with limited tweaks to the free market, incentivizing companies to keep workers here ( through tax regulations)

2. Customers get together and boycott companies who outsource, thereby incentivizing them to keep jobs here

Whats the 2nd way?

Sorry hit send too soon !

These fuckers need taking in to public ownership ..end of problem ..

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The rub of this is that unlike stopping buying Hovis or even any of your bread from Asda its really hard (in relative terms) for people to stop buying energy from one company added to which you'll never get enough support for it to matter to them.

Years of weak government (Not just the current lot) have ensured that the big 6 can hold the UK to ransom at will, Cameron and Clegg will attack the sick, unemployed and weak first, they'll back the big business owners and will fuck over the normal working people. They're out of touch with reality and have no idea what it means to struggle.

I don't agree with public ownership & big government but for essential utilities its perhaps the best way.

The days of job security are gone, I used to think of certain jobs as dead certs, no way will you ever not be needed, but i think there is no such thing now.

I'm very lucky to be in a job, a nicely paid one within walking distance of home, but if cuts were made, n i was on the scrap heap tomorrow, i'd be screwed as the bills I have pretty much swallow up every penny so i dont have savings or any type of rainy day fund.

The thought of going to the job centre and having to sign on and mingle with certain people in there is not summit I'd like to think about at all.

But as you say they are 6 companies, so if everyone makes it clear they will use the non outsourcer there is an inventive for one of those companies to change their business model
Unfortunately all those companies get together which is price fixing and illegal

Yes, that's the reality facing many. Two paydays away from disaster.
I suppose it's always been like that for most workers, but now we're all so dependant on very high cost rent, transport, heating etc that as soon as a wage stops, there's an unstoppable tsunami of debt.

Been there and did that. I honestly can't think of a job I'd turn down in favour of another week on the dole, I know its an inevitable fact of life that if you're unemployed you should sign on but its a seriously degrading experience.

I'm lucky in the respect that our lasses job is very secure and that means we'd never be out on the street if I lost my job but far too many people I know are a paycut never mind lost payday away from the brink.

Doing some digging it seems all may not be well with RWE who own Npower as they've been selling assets and have pulled out of their plans to build an offshore windfarm.

It was.

They have massive (Billions of Euros) debts and are in the process of selling off their North sea Oil and Gas interests.

Hit the feckers where it hurts, I transferred last night from N-Power to OVO, saved a potential £250 per year and felt good about it.

Any of the smaller companies are good idea ..resign the lot of them to the dustbin of history then they WILL stop ripping us off

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Unfortunately the smaller suppliers still have to buy their energy from the big 6 so they offer little comfort. I've changed supplier a number of times and would avoid First Utility at all costs - they didn't know how to calculate a bill and their customer service was shocking, worse than any of the big 6 in my experience. The main problems are
1. What was a simple business has become massively complicated due to the fragmentation of the industry. This all adds to costs.
2. Successive governments and regulators have not had a clue how to contain costs. Everything they have tried to open the market, force company splits, sell offs etc has failed. The result is that most of the big 6 are foreign owned and make most of their profit on energy trading activities that are centered abroad and not part of UK accounts
3. Government have forced rises in costs through measures like the closure of the cheapest coal fired power stations - replacing them with expensive renewables etc, carbon taxes, climate change levy
4. The only option is price regulation but that flies in the face of the 'market' approach favoured by economists

I watched the Select Committee hearing and it was a shame that the MPs didn't know enough about the market to get to the bottom of why OVO costs are lower then the big 6 costs. Its down to the fact OVO have bought from the wholesale market over a period of time whereas the big 6 suppliers buy from their own energy trading divisions at full current market price. So in a rising market the big 6 costs will always be higher than the smaller suppliers costs. The trading divisions are not UK companies so outside the remit of UK regulation.

So sounds like a fixed vs float cost issue, worth noting locking these costs in are often done via 'derivatives' which are flagged as financial evil by most in politics, and bought by the masses

Amen

I would add into that aging infrastructure. When nationalised they inherited a good deal of infrastructure that is now tired and costs squillions to replace / upgrade. They, for some strange reason, dont want to pay for this themselves and would prefer to pass all the costs on to us. Even though they knew the age of it, have generated a tons of cash profit since privitisation and have taken the decision to pay fuck loads of dividends throughout that time.

Cos theyre not nice people.

There is a liquid forward market in coal, gas, carbon emissions, electricity and other energy commodities that are traded 24/7 by the big 6, other energy companies and financial institutions. There is a clear parallel between the banking and energy crises. The high street banks are like the generation and supply divisions of the big 6, dull and not very profitable, and the energy trading is like the casino banking where profits can be very large. Unfortunately MPs and regulators don't understand this.

Mr MFR they have no obligation to supply so will hold government to ransom to ensure that any future investment is guaranteed to be profitable. So your conclusion is correct.

It all depends on how they are used, if used properly the market should allow them to lock in prices, if they are speculating or getting too clever with how they hedge then they are in trouble
Biggest driver is those in the market trying to get too fancy and not understanding or under appreciating their correlation risk

I think that they understand the markets very well and to a large degree use the markets for risk management and locking in the margin between fuel purchase and energy supply to guarantee profits. However the costs of such operations are significant, the profits are held offshore and the customer in the UK always ends up paying the premium.

We were all told that when the power producers were privatised we'd all feel the benefits of competition........ and we end up with them all marching in unison with each other and basically taking the piss..... what competition....?
As for n power....they 've just pushed me into finally switching suppliers....!

While we have a system where only career politicians from public schools whose rich families have huge interests in the city and financial institution linked businesses it will always be thus. Nobody with the skills to really understand fiscal and energy markets would become an MP for £60-70k a year + expenses when they can earn masses more working in those sectors.


By having a wholesale and a retail market, where the biggest players in both have huge stakes it means the big 6 get two (probably more from their production arms too) lots of profit in two places.

The big 6 also seem to think that something worse than piss poor customer service, unclear information and borderline misleading marketing is acceptable. I've never had cause to complain about my supplier or my bills but I won't be back at N-Power from January.

This should mean less volatility in the final price though even if it is a little higher, if they are suddenly upping prices by 19% it suggests they are not hedging properly, or are to your point taking all the hedging benefits but passing the risk onto the consumer.

Also while heavily related fuel prices and the price of the end product , power are not always in lock step or fully correlated

They hedge and lock in the margin guaranteeing profit. When the wholesale market price rises the trading company sells to its own energy supply business at the new market price and the supply company ups its prices to customers. The upshot is that the energy trading company makes excess profits and the customer pays the full current market price so has gained nothing from the risk management process. When the regulator comes calling both UK based generation and UK supply businesses have made very little profit, the market price has risen so all is well !!!

Yes, they lock in their downside whilst maintaining their optionality, there needs to be greater regulation of trades between internal legal entities

When I say lock in I should say minimize the impact of their downside

There are alternatives; I'm not with one of the big 6.

Privatising a natural monopoly/oligopoly was never going to be a good idea, especially as it's an essential service.

OVO are going to win many more customers on grounds of ethics alone, it seems

Who ever gets Sir Billy Braggs tickets make sure you tell him what has happened he will be up un arms about it and write a class song slating the greedy fat cats

Be careful what you wish for. This is the Britain we voted for or maybe never, if so you should of voted. Was talking to a young lad at the bus stop tonight, he asked me if the bus to Station Town had gone, I said I didn't know, the lad was worried as it was probably the last bus. I was going to suggest he get the bus to Peterlee and then a Middlesbrough bus to Station Town, easy! but no it isn't because the bus to Station Town he had a ticket for was for a different company to the bus that went to Peterlee, and probably the lad didn't have a bean in his pocket, neither did I being payday tomorrow. No doubt he would of phoned his mum or dad or friend up and asked for a lift back, a hassle or expense they can probably ill afford. The buses in this part of the country are appalling and if ever an area needed the buses nationalised again its this one. This country and especially our part of it is dying a slow death.

Thanks for your concern.

Still up in the air for me, 60 day consultation period, with my options being move to Rainton, Move to Peterlee working for Capita, or take redundancy. The last might be the best option take my chances on getting another job before the lump-sum pay off runs out.

I've been with Ebico for years, a 'not for profit energy supplier' although their billing is run by SSE.

Apparently will get 'assistance' with travel costs, but I would be more concerned with getting there on time, I struggle to drag myself out of bed in the morning to do the 15 minutes to Thornaby.

And in two phrases, we have captured exactly what is wrong in this once-proud nation.
Real people with real families and real committments are being thrown to the dogs.

Recovery my ringpiece

totally 100% with you on this ... transport, essential services 9gas/water/electric) belong to the PEOPLE of the country, it is/was a fucking outrage that they were ever privatised

Thatcher is hopefully burning in hell as we speak

because SHE kicked it all off