Where the F*** have we suddenly found £7 BILLION to give the Republic Of Ireland a loan.

And one question..Why are we paying to keep the ROI in the Euro, we're not in it ??

Because if we didnt our export business will go to the dogs. We do more trade with ireland the lots of other countries put together. Also our banks have loaned them money previously so would put us in more debt. This money isnt being given to them its a loan so we will get interest to boot

Because RBS and Lloyds have already lent them £80 billion during their housing boom. Those banks are largely owned by the taxpayer so we don't want the Irish to default. Don't lose too much sleep over this - the pensions of the bank executives that got us in this mess are all safe.

We've been told that we have no money, so where is the money coming from that we intend to lend to the Irish????
Don't tell me that we are going to borrow it.
You know as in doing what the current lot criticised Gordon Brown for.

Its funny that the exact amount we are lending too the Irlish is the exact amount that all the cuts etc will earn next year, therefore we the common man on the street are feeling the pintch and the public sector cuts to achieve nothing as its going to the Irish.

That said though we have to stop Irleand going under along with help from the EU and IMF, if we dont as said earlier it will harm us more than to the tune of 7Billion as they wont be able to buy our export, this will result in small businesses loosing out.

No - we just print extra - its called quantitative easing.

PS don't try this at home - its called forgery

It's never wise to try things at home, if you're the wrong class. Recently a Co. Durham man found that a 5 figure sum had found its way into his bank account. He knew it wasn't his, but he spent some of it before owning up. He was arrested for not being a banker..

We're not really in as much debt as Ireland, Greece, Spain and Portugal.

The cuts we're making are to make sure that we dont end up like Ireland, Greece, Spain or Portugal.

Apparently we borrow the money to lend them at a rate of 1.5% and Ireland pay it back at a rate of 5%. Sounds like a good deal to me.

Thought that was what the 750bn euro European Financial Stability Fund (EFSF) was for . . . to support countries within the Euro

I made the same point the other day - someone having a go at working class people fiddling a few extra quid and calling them scumbags. Only because this person has been brainwashed by the Government and whatever daily newspaper etc into believing it. MP's, bankers, business/corporate executives, civil servants, royalty etc don't very often get caught doing it but even when they do it's swept under the carpet.
However for you and me to do it is seen as an attempt at undermining the system itself - punishable by jail and being stripped of everything you own.
If you are not part of the system or part of the mechanism that enforces it, e.g. police, then you are fu-cked if you are caught.
Bashing an old granny to death is not seen as undermining the system, so that seems to carry a lesser sentence than tax evasion or whatever.
I'm all for fiddling tax etc, and given the chance I bloody well will - but it's highly unlikely for a start that I'll be in that position - and then we have our own kind grassing us up in the belief that they are doing something for the greater good.

Ah, the greater good.

Spot on parmo. And though its a comedy Hot Fuzz wasnt far off the truth. I hate this government, like I hated the last one. Infact I am beginning to hate this country, and its so called freedom. Is it hell free. We are now even being taxed to pay for bankers bonuses. And dont even think about ever becoming a student. Why even on the little old bunker it seems that being a student is something to take the piss out of. All for the greater good.

They are already helping Spain, Portugal and Greece as well as going to help Ireland. The point I was making is not helping Irleand would be counter productive as would hurt our industry more as the biggest customer would go out of business or reduce their spending.

Didn't the paddys make a big song and dance for years about independence? Now they're in trouble they're running home to daddy for a top up.

My main gripe with the "loan" is we appear to be doing it to keep ROI in the euro.

It's a eurozone problem. Not ours. So if Portugal or Italy is next, will we be doing the same for them.

And if this loan doesn't help will we need to lend more will ROI default on payments, it's way above my head but I just can't see the point in it.

Surely countries within the euro should have been the one's to meet the full amount needed. Just an opinion.

So your main gripe appears to be based upon absolute horseshit?

I'm glad we cleared that up.

Its all utter madness. Everyone seems to owe someone billions. Therefore there are some people sitting at the top of this money tree coining in trillions.

So who is it, and why are countries dancing to their tune?

They should be told that they gambled and now the gamble has backfired and be told to fuck off. Let them sue.

Its time this madness was stopped. Yes, I understand that things would go pear shaped, but they need to. Unless you agree that tens of millions losing their jobs, homes etc is worth it for the greater good. Whatever the greater good is.

Ermm that would be the Rockerfella's and the Rothschild's the basically own the world have fingers in all the pies, on the boards of every mulit-national and goverment companies and are best mates with Henery Kissinger.

Problem-reaction-solution

In other words loan a country lots of money, cause a problem that you want "a recestion" and then call the money back therefore controlling the world. Its subtle but this is how wars / goverments are made and dance to their tune, its being going on since the banks (safes) were created and people loaned out more than they had. e.g. a bank only holds a fraction of the money it actually lends, so if a bank has 1 trillion the loan out about 100 trillion knowing than not everyone will want their money at the same time.

They are creating money out of thin air by charging interest on something they dont have.

Well said Mr C. Appreciate they are our neighbours but we have to draw a line in the sand and say to banks, PLC's, nation states exactly what bankers say to us when we run out of cash. Your fook up - sort it. We cannot and should not not bail out private companies - fook em. If ROI had been so desperate to save their 4 banks, we collectively wouldnt be lending them the money.

This is a sign of a greater malaise and if it needs a big shock to the system to sort it - fair enough.

The point as always is - if you owe a little, the problem is yours (and you will be put to the wall). If you owe a lot, the problem is the lenders. The only trouble is I can't find a credit card with a £50 billion limit.

The difference here is that its governments that are in debt, but its the average person that will lose his/her job to pay for it. This is not personal debt. But many personal beings are benefiting from millions misery. In any caring society that is just wrong. And if it isnt addressed this country will end up with massive civil unrest. And the police wont do anything to stop it, because they will be losing their jobs and homes as well.

Are you so naive to think that this hasnt been going on for years, there are maybe thre / four families in the world that have been benefitting from wars (the mojority they have "created" buy calling back debt) and recessions for years.

Unfortunatly there is no such thing as a caring society the only way this will ever stop is by "free lending" a system to an extent that Lincoln with his greenbacks and JFK talked about, and what look what happened to them when the voiced it.

The only other way would be to draw all your money out of the bank at once, and I mean everyone, then refuse to put it back in until the system is sorted, however this is impossible as the world economy would crash and the banks wouldnt allow it as the rich folk at the top of the tree would keep their money in the banks as they are getting a very nice deal and always have been.

Bob, I am pleased to note that finally after all these years you have decided to side with Lady Thatcher. She was, as I'm sure you will agree, light years ahead of everyone in fighting to keep the UK out of the Euro because she believed that it would ensure that Britian was dragged into the same pot as Eurozone failed currencies.

What a visionary she was. Isn't she dead yet?

Fortunately not. She's alive and well and still very fanciable.

I don't get it.
Does horseshit disprove someone else's theory these days?

No, his claim that it's all about keeping Eire in the Euro does that all by itself.

What the hell has naivity got to do with it? It needs to happen. It doesnt matter what the history books are telling you. What they also tell you is that we are subserviant and lay down and get rodgered regularly by the system, and it goes without saying, that it will happen again. We must take our punishment whilst the filthy rich just get fatter, and richer. But hey, we must all suffer, because thats what we always do.

Me side with Lady Thatcher......

More chance of me wearing a F****** darlo shirt, while auditioning for Britain's got talent while farting 2 little boys and winning it.

I suppose that's one way to get them back out.

Well, you may be right, Mr R, but as so often we wait with bated breath for your well-reasoned, evidence-based argument....
.

No, I like the way some of the youth of the board tend toward these 'teaching your granny how to suck eggs' situations. It often brightens up a dull day.

The forced contribution is all about the legacy of Darling and the last Labour government.

The additional loan is about protecting British trade and the debts owed to British banks.

The debts owed to british banks? I thought someone had to bail our banks out not so long ago because of their own debts? The whole thing is just one huge money laundering exercise, designed to keep the already bloated rich happy.

Well done for realising what has been going on for years. But unfortunatly the banks have their balls in the hands of the people they owe money too, therefore these people can cause a recession when they want to gaining more money and power over governments.

Are we on about the Premiershit and the Champions League now?

We all already know that. What we are saying is that its about time WE stopped it. Dont you see that?

Also guess what Rothschild Bank AND Goldman Sachs Are Both On The LIST Of Bondholders Getting Taxpayer Billions In Irish Bailout.

These are the same people, Norman Lamont thinks should not be punished for risky investments, instead that UK and Irish taxpayers should graciously acquiesce and give the banksters what they want... mmm lovely fella

It's all very, very straightforward. Owe Kneecap Finance plc the sum of £100 and they will come around on a visit and and reposition your kneecaps with a baseball bat. Owe Kneecap Finance plc the sum of £5,000 and they will ensure you end up as part of the motorway system encased in concrete. Owe Kneecap Finance plc the sum of £170 billion and they'll come round and lend you some more. Simple innit...?

Last year I was involved in the purchase of a sizeable business where sums of almost £100 million was borrowed. Unfortunately I didn't get to own it personally but I was part of the team doing the due diligence.

However I did have an interesting conversation with venture capitalist regarding borrowing large sums of money and he explained the process to me. I'm paraphrasing here but essentially its much easier to borrow millions than it is thousands because of the people you are talking to.

Lets say that you have one bloke wanting to borrow £15k by way of a personal loan. He talks to the bank and they credit score him etc. The bank start from a default position of no unless there is evidence that the borrower can pay it back; credit history etc. All the way through the process the lender is looking for reasons why they should not lend. They focus entirely on risk.

On the other hand, if a venture capitalist wants to borrow £50m he talks to investment bankers whose default position is yes unless there are good reasons why not. For good reasons read 'information that could come back on me should it go pear shaped within the next few years'. The investment banker wants it to happpen because he's in for 15% of the profit by way of bonus.

So on a loan of £50m @ 8% interest = the Investment Banker pockets £600k so of course he wants it to happen and he's not really bothered if it defaults after a couple of years because he's moved on and there is no clawback on the bonus.

Mr Compo, bondholders are only repaid when their bonds mature. They won't be getting anything now other than the fixed interest rate on their bonds (they can sell their bonds in the bond market). The list doesn't include RBS and Lloyds TSB who loaned £81 billion to Irish banks.

cheers you learn something every day.