You could have said you disagreed with my take but I reckon I am now entitled to ask you what you see as this mark I am wide of. Always bearing in mind that a lot of civil servants work there full time and the PM lives there.

yes eastender.....do tell us how no 10 operates ???..we're all waiting with baited breath.......

The point I was getting at amongst others is that I very much doubt that civil servants could decide to have a drink up in the No 10 garden and just crack on with it by sending out invites and getting the drinks in. I'd imagine that it would have to be cleared by a variety of people, including security (given that it is one of the most sensitive addresses in the country), so I don't buy the idea that it's down to civil servants. Someone had to clear it and give it the ok, surely?

Isn't it about time that paper let MP's have some private time?


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/8901060/l ... n-illegal/

You are not taking into account that the e mail invitations were sent out by the top civil service aide to the PM, who works at number 10. Plus the fact they were sent to people who actually work there and therefore have already got security clearance. The decisions that were made were to work outside and permission to bring drink was given, presumably to be consumed when the days work was completed. The PM was informed and attended the gathering for 25 minutes to thank everyone for their efforts. Social distancing was observed we are told. Did Bojo have a drink? Nobody has confirmed that he did or he didn't, so accusing him of attending a boozy party is a bit OTT. He could hardly have got into a party mood in twenty five minutes, whilst getting pissed out of his head.
Like I said the whole thing doesn't make sense.
There is an agenda attached to this. Should it have happened? I don't think so but in hindsight Bojo has admitted he should have stopped it and has apologised for it. I think he will be watching closely in future and will probably intensify the ground rules but department heads have got to take some responsibility.
Number 10 is a workplace and also a home. Knowing that the staff were working in the garden would prompt any PM to go out and be seen for a short period of time and that is what he did. Just because he is a Tory PM you can't get the rope out every time he sneezes without using a tissue.
I have to remind you that I am a member of the Labour Party and contribute financially but, as I said at the very start of this pandemic, I am dead against political point scoring on this issue and my stance was endorsed by Keir Starmer when he became leader. He however has thrown that stance out of the window and, along with some of his shadow cabinet has tried to thwart, criticise and scaremonger ay every corner, backed by left wing media, and I can't condone that. If Labour becomes electable I want it to be because of policies not political point scoring.

I'm saying that any specific event anywhere in 10 Downing Street will need security and other clearance before it can happen. If that isn't the case then how would they know who is supposed to be there and who isn't?
If the civil servant didn't tell Johnson about it then that would be a straightforward breach of the civil serrvice code and dismissal potentially or more likely a sideways move elsewhere for the civil servant.

Btw I didn't think I was/am saying anything controversial here which is why I tried to make clear that I wasn't having a dig. I'm justb giving an honest view of how it is very likely to work, as it would at any government "head office".

as blairs big buddy lord falconer has said....."covid the gift that keeps on giving"....just sums up exactly how labour have responded to what is a national crisis ....political point scoring at every opportunity.....using the crisis for party political gain.....starmer is a fecking disgrace

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... armer.html

Labour scoring points.......
They think they’re scoring points and the media will patronisingly pat them on the head and tell them how well they’re doing.....then you look at the shadow front bench and.......

about time we get back to some real issues on how this country is doing. these party,s were wrong but no one died of them. however plenty will with our spending power being reduced and a one ailment health service waiting lists over 6 million. another distraction for us to forget and miss real important issues.

So you are suggesting that if say a person is leaving(which is another of the long line of revelations being drip fed to us), the head of that particular department, before sanctioning an event to send that person off, would have to knock on the PM's door and clear it with him. There are lots of departments probably containing thousands of people. You are suggesting every single Minister in charge of them plus every senior civil servant involved has to clear every decision with the PM.
There is a chain of command and responsibility, as there is in every organisation, and Government is no exception, so to expect the PM to know everyone's every move is taking individual responsibilty a step too far.
You might as well state that the PM should have known that Matt Hancock was cavorting in his office, or that Hancock should have "run his activities past the PM".
Really???????
Are we saying that the situation is under such tight control that anyone leaving their desk to answer a call of nature has to put their hands up or fill a form in.
What you are suggesting is logistically impossible as well as impracticable.
Should the PM know all things Downing St at all times, even when he's not there. Or, like any other top boss, does he rely on his minions to run the job for him, and then answer to him.
To have the situation as you suggest there would be a continuous queue in the corridor outside his office.

The media have their teeth into it, they’ll just go on like a dumb dog eating it’s own leg.

I think if I was Boris I would tell his own MP's, the media and the country that I was going to test this so called public mood and call an election. Do the public want me to go? Do the public want a change of Government and therefore give Labour a go? Or are they happy with the way we are going and are prepared to back me.
One, That would put the fear of God into his rebels, terrified of losing their seats.
Two,The media would suddenly wake up to the fact that they have orchestrated this situation and would probably be blamed for the performance of a new Government.
And Three, It would make the electorate decide whether they keep the devil they've got or go for Starmer or Davey or a combination of both.
It would put the decision slap bang into the laps of the rebels, the critics and the electorate.
Get the popcorn out and watch all these experts strut their stuff.

I suspect the meeeeja would salivate at the idea of a General Election. The sole role in their devious lives is to sit on the sidelines like rabid dogs enjoying the situations they create.
This whole nonsense has had the meeeeja fuelling messages of resentment, conspiracy theory and righteous outrage while they play the role they themselves scripted.

How do you think it works in 10 Downing Street then? People just do broadly as they please and civil servants just wing it in terms of keeping their minister informed about events which could be controversial and attract media attention? And if they fancy having their lunch in the garden they just breeze in there and start eating a sandwich? Believe what you like, I was simply trying to explain the reality of it so that you could get your argument clear, but I simply have to accept that you know far better than I do. Apologies for wasting your time.

No need to apologise.
You need to understand the concept of a chain of command and yes it is pretty much the norm to breeze into the garden to eat their sandwiches.
They do it with permission of their immediate boss and more often than not the PM wouldn't know, unless he looks out of a window or ventures into the garden himself.

Final point from me - the one thing that you don't seem to have thought about is why I might feel sufficiently informed to make the comments on this that I have. I assume that you think I'm just making it up off the top of my head.

The lyrics to this classic are so apt https://youtu.be/MNX1knUjZl4

eastender.......ooooo you are such a tease...... do you prefer guacamole to mushy peas ?

Peas every time, I cooked up a pound of them today after overnight soaking as it happens. For the freezer, not eating them all in one go....

You’d be amazed how much delegation actually goes on even at lower levels. The only two people who ran a country and ended up ‘controlling’ them completely where Stalin and Hitler....... with Stalin the winner by a country mile.
You’d be surprised how little those at the top know of the actual workings of government, they are transient politicians after all.

Anything to do with the rumours of booze runs from the Co-op to Westminster?...i know a lot of my friends wouldn't dream of shopping anywhere less than Marks and Spencers or Waitrose.

Can you imagine Starmer addressing his MP’s......” Ok comrades after our government rocking revelation of getting access to Boris’s school report, it means they are now holed below the waterline and about to go under, the people will rise up and the Queen ask me and Big Angela round sharpish to form a new Goverment.

Not at all. Instead of analysing me, you need to analyse yourself. Do you honestly believe that the PM has the time or inclination to spend valuable time scrutinizing what goes on in his garden.
Downing street is a workplace for a lot of people and those people have line management to direct them.
Expecting the PM to be involved in the day to day running of the various departments tells me that you are not as au fait as you would have us believe.

Any top businessman trying to be involved in the running of every single part of his organisation will age very rapidly and burn out. It is not physically, or more importantly, mentally possible, to sustain the workload advocated.
You have good line managers and delegate powers and screen new employees for their whistle blowing tendencies at that level, because they’re always politically motivated.

Exactly.

As an aside, according to the 1984 act any restrictions that are applied for emergencies such as this pandemic do not apply to crown land and 10 Downing St is crown land. No 10 could set themselves aside from this and sign a document waiving it but don't appear to have done so.
So no gatherings of any nature at number 10 are or were illegal, which is probably why the Met are reluctant to get involved.
The reason given for the exemption is that it is to free those working to fight the emergency are not restricted from carrying out their duties, especially Government.
I'm surprised that people who are au fait with the operations relating to number 10 aren't aware of this and as for the media, there's quite a bit of egg flying their way methinks.
Oh dear, talk about being played for mugs.

just sick of these abject apologies...and for what...a media driven mass hysteria ....shock horror....civil servants chomping cheese.... and supping wine from the co-op...in their offices ....or in the garden after work....so what ffs...the big dog needs to come out fighting.... and showing more of his teeth....

They’ve never forgiven him for Brexit.....their converted barn in the Tuscany, trips to Brussels, the good old days, the days of wine and roses, they want it back, they really do.

its a good distraction from issues that actually matter to everyone much more. duel, gas, electric prices going up and up. same with food and the inability to get an appointment with your GP surgery. more to come with extra nat. insurance contributions. can see a year of struggle for so many but what do we get thrown in our faces. garden party,s and the grand old duke of york.

The people to blame Mr Fan are Boris and Andrew, no one else, it's very simple really.

Couldn’t give a shite about Andy, as for Boris, nah, this has went on since he became PM.
Since that day, Labour have trademarked the word ‘Sleaze’ to be chanted mantra like at every occasion over bollocks, but gullible Joe Public sees it on the telly so it must be so.
Goebbels first rule, control the media, control the people. We have a very compliant media it would appear.

Watched Sophie Raworth make Starmer squirm this morning.
Is he the answer.
He actually accused the PM of concentrating on Downing St parties instead of Covid. You couldn't make it up. It's all he has concentrated on for weeks.


In other news the BBC subsidy has been slashed by two billion quid and the licence fee frozen for two years.
You don't bite the hand that feeds you. It never has worked and never will.

Snowy, you have a point up to a degree , however, most of the media generally support the Conservatives. Also people love to have a go at the BBC when this Boris thing was exposed by the Mirror and ITV news. The biggest mark of a democracy is when you are allowed to criticise without censure. Nadine Dorries is very biased to say the least.

The right to comment is sacred but commenting also carries responsibility.
As for the Conservatives being ‘supported’ by the media...c’mon ..... and seriously I ain’t a Tory I can assure you.
The BBC at all levels has it’s own agenda that stands out like a lighthouse in the desert.
Like I said, the media have had the vapours and been in fuming disbelief that the plebs weren’t persuaded as evidenced by the Brexit vote and the consequent meltdown of a lot of MP’s in Parliament opened my eyes in abject horror to the mealy mouthed self indulgence they portrayed.

I think the BBC has become a bete noir for many people but you didn't answer the fact that ITN have driven a lot of anti Govt sentiment whether it's the latest scandals or the housing crisis etc I want the UK media to be all over any Govt or political Party, and yes it should be done in a responsible way.

worth remembering that leaflet posted through every door in the uk....at cost 11 million ...and backed up by the bbc at every opportunity in project fear...somehow think there are those who are intent on fighting on.... and this is all part of it......

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... the-uk.pdf

I don’t watch ITV, BBC or Channel 4 News or much else on those channels any more, so I won’t be addressing what I haven’t heard.
I avoid the mainstream media, there’s a world of news and different views out there at your finger tips, you just have to look for it.

And apparently the Chinese influence is in all the parties, that's very worrying Snowy. Mr Poolie1 , Project Fear was a rather poor attempt by Cameron and Osbourne to frighten people. You must also remember the famous battle bus logo. Both campaigns were dreadful and an embarrassment for democracy. Both were also mainly funded by wealthy businessmen , we the British public were talked down to by the usual politicians who will always come out on top.

[quote="Poolie27"]And apparently the Chinese influence is in all the parties, that's very worrying Snowy.[quote]

The £420,000 given to the Labour MP was for what.....? Surely you can’t just hand over that amount of money for nothing....?
Good old Kier is probably too involved in wallpaper, drinks and school reports to bother with trivia like one of your MP’s getting all that money for what off a foreign national or anyone come to that.....? As your so keen at revealing everything, I suggest you get your arse into gear and give us the lowdown on this...... and any other Party it applies to.

I don't need to get my arse in gear Snowy, won't your 'meeja' do that for us ?

I was referring to Starmer’s ‘arse’.... your’s is more than safe with me.

[quote="Snowy"][
The BBC has become arrogant, pompous and self righteous, a channel ( because that’s all it is ) with a permasmirk on it’s face.

just going back to just reporting news and not putting their own slant on it would help them no end. if they did that news programmes could offer a wider variaty of news in the time taken up yapping to their pet scientists, doctors and government officials who all follow one single line.

I see Lineker and co are whinging about the cuts in funding.
Gravy train is coming to a halt Gary.

question...was starmer on the piss at work...or is he taking the piss...or both ???

gary...my heart bleeds for you...what ......anther pay cut ??

He should be paying us for putting up with him and his chums and semi house trained pet Shearer, radiating smugness and sitting in judgement on players and managers when they probably couldn’t even manage a bowel movement after a mackerel curry.
Get shot, there’s more talent out there than that boring gathering of the tedious.

How dare you!

Those were the days

I'd like to thank all at M15 for warning the British government and public of this , rare for them ??..Leave no stone unturned lads if your're looking in

So Snowy, did you see the Boris apology the other day? Is Mr David Davis wrong ?