It started to change , around 10 years ago , one of the reasons I got out, when they fast tracked loads of young refs through the system , Sunday League one year, NL a few years later, many of them IMO without the life experience to be able to do the job effectively. It became more about managing the game as opposed to applying the laws.

yes, game management and a total reliance on physical fitness before anything else. even promotion to one level is just passing a fitness test and nothing else. even at my age i can more or less keep up with play in a good game as i can read it. too poor sides then i,m lost. you do not want officials permanently miles from the action in games but because you are good round a running track does not make you a new harold webb either.

Many years ago I was sat next to a League Linesman at a pools game and he pointed out the young ref. was a FA blue eye about to be fast tracked. His name Mark Clatternburg.

Remember Clattenburg having an appalling game at Pools one night, League Cup v Tranmere early noughties. All refs have bad games though , you could say its having those bad games that make the best refs, if you learn from it and bounce back. It really is one of those professions where you have had to have done it for at least a couple of years to understand what it is like, fans forget or don't understand its not always about applying the law to the letter, but quite often about common sense and making decisions that let the game flow and keep the peace that sometimes means refs break their own rules in order to achieve that.

that's a interesting read on mr horden's times as a tough no-nonsense ref.

big respect sir.

Thanks. Not sure about tough, I was no nonsense like, but like to think that I was a common sense ref. I got into it late , and though it wasn't too late to climb the ranks, I never had any ambition to do that, therefore the pressure was off, whereas the young refs with ambition get constantly hounded by assessors, knocking any individuality out of them and turning them into robots.

I do think our refs in the Prem and Championship are very good though and the ones at the very top are IMO are some of the best in the world. One thing we do and always have done in the UK is produce good referees, even those we moan about further down at our level are miles better than what you will generally find in other countries.

[quote="horden"] the young refs with ambition get constantly hounded by assessors, knocking any individuality out of them and turning them into robots.


then plenty either pack it in or just decide to concentrate on local saturday and sunday league leaving the bullshit behind. know one personally who was on his way up doing an fa cup game at york last season on the line who got fed up of criticism for doing his job, enforcing the correct laws of the game, and decided to stay local.

talking about clattenburg i wonder if people knew the reason why he always wore a long sleeved shirt. because the cad decided on having a tatoo which the fa frowned upon. with players having more tatoo than skin on view that was a typical fa reaction and shows the ideas of people running our game.

Wouldn't like to be reffing or running line at the top with VAR. Officials must be nervous, knowing their decision could be overturned. Noticed Michael Oliver at Villa yesterday changed his mind about a penalty in the last minute , after looking at the monitor. Oliver has bollocks and I think would've changed his mind even if a crowd had been in, but how many would've done that, especially against the home team , if there had been 40.000 in? I think a lot would've taken the easy option and awarded the penalty. At non league level a ref would get lynched for doing what Oliver did yesterday.

[quote="horden"][


Wouldn't like to be reffing or running line at the top with VAR. Officials must be nervous, knowing their decision could be overturned.
its worse running the line because of the total obsession in getting one law totally correct, the offside law. never really enjoyed running the line that much even though at one time i was regarded as a better linesman than a referee. a few games with referees who think its all about them and overturn your correct decisions leaves a bit of a bad taste in your mouth but wait long enough you,ll get your own back when they really want your important decision to back up their cock ups.

I enjoyed running the line.

I think at the top Linesman or assistants as they are now called, do that and nothing else whereas in the past all linos were refs just running the line at a usually higher level

Just saw this

Ref for yesterdays MIDDLESBROUGH v NORWICH game Tony Harrington from ....... HARTLEPOOL

I know Tony, good lad and a good ref. not a robot IMO, but a ref so local to the home club. I know the rules aren't as strict as they used to be regarding where a ref is from ( refs used to have to come from more or less halfway between the clubs back in the day) but never known anything like this before at such a high level game.

Hartlepool hasn’t done to bad for league referees I can go back to Ron Judson, Bill Heselton,Ken Ridden and more lately Ian Cruikshank. We also have ? Beswick regularly on the line at big premier league games.
Mind you couldn’t go past Stan Evans (not sure of surname) refereeing local leagues for many years. Might not have been the greatest ref. But the most enthusiastic and likeable bloke who was well respected by the players.

Interesting listening to the Boro fans yesterday analysing the penalty they had disqualified for a double kick as the lad who took it slipped as he took it. Many saying it's a ridiculous ruling and harsh as if the keeper moves too early the penalty is retaken. Then this guy rings in and says as the ball has not moved a full circumference it's basically not 'in play' so should have stood. Difficult one.

Think my dad worked with Stan Evans at Steetley in the late 90s.

Law 14 The player taking the penalty kick must kick the ball forward; backheeling is permitted provided the ball moves forward. ... The kicker must not play the ball again until it has touched another player. The penalty kick is completed when the ball stops moving, goes out of play or the referee stops play for any offence.

Seen some grainy footage and its difficult to see whether he touched it twice or not. If he did , and I'm guessing he did, the ref got it right. These are the incidents though that make the job difficult, imagine chalking a pen like that off at Grays on a Sunday morning or likewise allowing it?

I live for the day now that someone has the neck to back heel a penalty into the net

Tony still refs in the hartlepool sunday league too.

Fair play. Tony was in charge of the refs course I did at Owton Manor School. Not surprised he was involved in a controversy on Saturday at the boro. I find he is often involved in controversy, but I put that down to not ducking the big calls, how it should be IMO. A good ref , that should be heading for the Premier, though they may view what I have just said differently , and therein lies the problem.

Fulham did a similar pen y'day but the lad missed so it didnt give the ref a choice to make.

I seem to remember him getting some grief off the birmingham manager a few years ago for not allowing a play on.

He's only a young lad so prob wont hit his peak for a few years. I always liked the young ginger lad in the hartlepool leagues too, gilbraith, good ref who talked to you n let you know why he made a call, was working his way up the leagues but went to work on the cruise ships in a band so i think he's stopped the reffing now, he had potential.

Good too see someone from the town doing well, having some passion for the sport and even helping out his own town when they need him on a Sunday morning.

Good grief, Fulham and penalties, shocking.

Good that Tony still refs on a Sunday, says a lot about his committment, practice makes perfect in any sport and mixing with the lads on the rec helps keep your feet on the ground. As you say would be great for the town if we had a Premier League ref. They love Howard Webb in Rotherham, son of a miner anarl, and had a miners brass band play at his wedding.

Ran the line once with Craig Gilbraith at the old Team Northumbria in the Northern League, saw him running the line at Easington the other week, so he is still around. If he is still at that level it does sound though like he has decided against climbing the ladder.

Reading the latest Harry Walter Mitty Shithead book reminds me of Craig, who only looked about 14 when I was reffing, only looks about 16 now to be fair. In the book this supporter shouts at the lino,

" Oi Lino ! you should pack this in and concentrate on your paper round "

totally agree for both reasons. so many football league officials just pack the game in once they come off the league list and never referee again. many become assessors though but you,d think if they were that interested in the first place they,d do some local games in their area. at least they,d get money to keep themselves fitter that paying to join a gym or trudging round a park or pavements running just for the sake of it.

Good too see him back at it, would like too see him back in hartlepool as a few of the new refs are... well i wont even say.