Right then, I've deleted the posts referred to in the letter I received this morning and one thing is clear, for 20 years moderation has been very very light touch and that has to change somewhat. I'm not saying that opinions will be censured just that any direct accusations that cannot be backed up with proof that can constitute libel has to be taken down. The reality is that even if a post is absolutely true but a writ is issued for libel, that would have to be defended at a cost starting around the 100k mark.

To this end we need several new moderators, preferably some with a bit of sense and definitely not a Jonny come lately persona of the same person who we all know who it really is. If you're up for it let me know.

The posts that have been deleted have been started in one instance by a user called "TwoTimes" his one and only post.
The second which is arguable by Mr Snowy
The third by Mutley

In every example the complaint is in my view justified. Whatever you might think of Raj Singh you cannot state a guess as fact when it demeans the person in question, be that RS or anyone else. Much as it goes against the grain we have to moderate these thing and take down potentially libellous posts, especially at the moment when emotions are high. The alternative is the end of the Bunker. I take a fair bit of responsibility as because of work stuff I've spent very little time on the board and even less thinking about moderation. Mr Derwent has warned about this but I've been to busy to give it much attention, that has to change, I'm not risking my house for a message board.

There is PLENTY of scope for calling a spade a spade and criticising the handling of HUFC without a Moderator having to step in. Just need to be careful.

Indeed.

"My client takes issue with posts that cannot on any basis be said to be fair comment but fall within the categorisation of fiction, offensive or downright defamatory". That's the crux of the point and its a fair one.

If that’s how things are going, no point in looking over your own shoulder, we live in a mad world…might as well call it a day.
It was fun while it lasted, and I wish you all the best , but it seems to have stopped being fun anymore….ah well, that’s life shipmates

What I would say is feel this is a certain person's way of shutting the fans free speech up. While I agree there has to be truth in the rumours that can be backed up, it does however work both ways and if the club was more open and transparent the speculation would not have started in the first place.
I feel it would be a good idea under the title of the bunker a precis of your number 2 be written so we can read it and stay within the law.

I’m pretty sure that Singh did this during his final hurrah at Darlo, I.E. threatened the message board owner with heavy stuff to quieten things down.

As I say I’m pretty sure but lawyers please note, I’m not 100% saying he did do it, just that I’m pretty sure, I could be wrong like, but I don’t think I am. I hope that’s clear.

This is the way messageboards are going...... There is a boro messageboard (fmttm) that as stopped private messages between posters, because apparently the owner is even responsible for what is said privatly between posters even via private messages on that platform!!!!!!!The world is fucked!!

Not really surprised when some are posting that individuals are posting stuff that states that dodgy stuff has been going on as a simple statement rather than backed with evidence.
Look at the way Have I Got News For You changed as a result of threatened legal action, message boards are not immune.
And to suggest that a VPN will protect your identity is naive in the extreme, it might offer a bit of protection against your internet provider or casual snoopers but not from official agencies and determined hackers.
Doesn't mean the end of the board, or restrictions on most banter, just means stopping lies being misrepresented as truth and the harm to reputation, business, and even personal lives that might result.

Only 2 ways to shut the fans up.

Leave or shape up.

A good team gets the plaudits.
A bad team gets a tad of Criticism.

That's how football fans roll. Simple as that.

Years ago before the Internet shit it could get a bit angry in n around the grounds.

There's a slight over reaction to a badly run football club.
Why make a mountain out of a mole hill.

Didn't Raj slander the Trust?

Oh, oh, PICK ME!

Well, at least my name isn't John! Even if I'm in fancy dress!

I don’t care what your name is you foxy bitch.

Marry me Ethel, and we'll honeymoon in Port Clarence.

Hopefully the letter didn’t suggest that we can’t or shouldn’t criticise Raj or the board? If someone has an opinion that they are doing a terrible job and there needs to be change, that’s surely a legitimate comment? Other people are free to disagree and put the opposite case.
I do appreciate the position this puts Mr I in though, which is pretty shitty because he shouldn’t have to be responsible for policing individual thoughts. I’m sure we’ll all help him out by being more careful and precise with the language we use. Got to say though, in my opinion, this is very heavy handed. It sows division when bridges need to be built.

Was the letter from Raj or his people, or someone else?

Apologies in advance if this is "illegal".

I wonder if due to the fact Raj is staying he'll want to crack down on here to curb dissent? A few years ago you'd see a few anti Raj comments, now every post on Facebook and Twitter is flooded with them. I wonder if he sees The Bunker as "the source" of all this, after all, this place was for some reason considered the official HUST forum for years even though it never ever was, it just happened to be the place a lot of HUST founders congregated on (on the virtue of been passionate enough about Pools to be on a forum for it).

I guess if you want to stay, may as well try and kick out all the dissenters you can! It's a bit like the time Pol Pot decided to kick out all the intellectuals out of Cambodia, I'm sure that went well!!!

The letter was essentially a warning about posts that are abusive and wrong. As in law, fair comment is precisely that but when it strays into incorrect derogatory statements proporting to be fact without evidence then we get into areas of libel.

The letter from from a barrister and a real one, I’ve looked him up on the bar council register.

Think it's more the unsubstantiated stuff like suggesting he's fleecing the club and more recently stuff criticising his core business Care Home costs and treatment of staff and residents rather than general moaning about his tenure on the whole.
HIGNFY used to add the word "allegedly" to a lot of commentary.

How does the barrister know that what was posted did not lack any proof?

The role we have, that is all of us, is that if we want to have a forum like this we have to protect it. Mr I owns the form and I moderate it, by invitation. The rest of members use it to air their views and opinions.
The problem here is we are being accused of using the forum or allowing the forum to be used, as a medium to personally attack the owner of the football club we associate ourselves to.
The complaint in the letter specifically uses particular posts and posters as examples of the complaint.
The question we have to consider is has the complaint got any credence and if so how do we deal with it.
The complaint is genuine and was made by a genuine Barrister on behalf of Raj Singh.
Mr I is taking this matter very seriously and I totally agree with his stance.
Further measures have to be implemented to protect the bunker and it's membership from any chance of threats of litigation. We ignore these threats of court action at our peril.
We need full compliance on this matter from all our members or the very existence of the forum will be at risk.
I have requested politely in the past for members to take a step back. I'm afraid we are now at the point where we are going to have to make demands.
We don't want a long list of do's and don'ts and mass taking down of posts, coupled with suspensions and bans.
However this is up to you, the membership. The onus has to be shared by all of us, no hiding.
As I have said before we all know what needs to be done, so let's do it.

I don't know to be honest, Contacting them is the road to answer your question.

That is a matter for The Trust.

If posters are being named and possibly threatened to be sued for libel, then surely they are allowed to defend themselves over what they posted under the laws of this country? A simple apology could be good enough if the person was unaware of what they wrote could cause stress to the complaintant. Or is the letter a threat to what may happen if it continues?

See Mr I's post further up today (timed at 2-26)

It's a warning shot across our bows.

But Raj is a really rubbish Chairman of Football Clubs...he's proved that at 2 Football Clubs. That's my opinion...allegedly.

Looks like more direct action is needed...though not by me of course.

Example: Saying that someone is a rubbish chairman as opinion is legally fair comment. Saying for example that he’s using the club to drain funds would be libellous.

Unless of course you had irrefutable proof. If not then don't say it.

then whats is the difference if you call a player rubbish and then go on to say that they are lazy, do not try or are only available for selection when they feel like. comments that have been made loads of times against certain players without any trouble. what facts have fans actually got for saying that as its only opinions based on what they see or feel. when you are in the eyes of people there surely are different rules than slagging off someone who works with a handful of people behind closed doors. how many chairman/owners been slagged off with generalisation over the years and why should raj singh be any different. for a start i,d guess the oystons at blackpool have had far worse comments than raj has ever had to suffer and other owners at pools also.

then the vast amount of political debate would end today both inside and outside of parliament. think this goes further than the bunker and we could be entering a new world if we are not careful. this all started by some saying, you can,t say that anymore.

If Raj really wanted to sell the club, why is he that bothered about what people are saying now?!? Can he not just sell and walk away!

I thought the whole point of him selling the club originally was because of the 'negative' feedback he had received from fans, hence why he stepped down as chairman and put the club up for sale. So why not go through with the sale!!!

What he has done with the vote and the Paul Frost video is to alienate fans even more.
He should be thick enough skinned to accept criticism, especially with the antics he has more than evidently shown!

The longer he stays, the bigger the debt!
Just cut your losses Raj and sell!

A letter from a barrister to the Bunker from Raj is the work of a very egotistical person and I suspect Raj is very proud of that.

And that is my opinion, people may agree or disagree, certainly it is not libelous.

Completely agree 100% with all of that Stocksfield.

I don't think any of this prevents comment though. Accounts appeared to be much healthier just a couple of years ago (particularly 2022) and we are yet to see the latest accounts. In his interview, Mr. Singh himself said he had to put in money to avoid a winding up order. There is no evidence to suggest that the accounts have been deliberately drained (and it's therefore wrong for anyone to state that), but I'm sure fans would like to have a clearer picture of how our money is spent. It would be constructive for the club to communicate the financial health of the club, explain the challenges and give information about the business plan going forward. Rumours and accusations grow from the absence of information and it is within the gift of the owner and board to communicate more effectively.
In my opinion it is therefore disappointing that time and money has been spent on a barrister, when time being spent on communication could lead to a more positive outcome for all. Hopefully this episode leads to better from all parties.

And a spare 100k or so to defend the writ

will that be still the case if one bunkerite sues another. just thinking about jamie and snowy.

Very surprised it's from a barrister rather than from a solicitor which obviously shows how seriously Raj is taking some comments on here.
As for communication from the club and Raj himself could have lead to a more positive outcome, I seriously doubt that's whenever he has communicated it's been deemed lies and deception by some.
Totally agree being a football club owner means you ideally have thick skin, but when unsubstantiated accusations of serious wrongdoing are made not only about the club but about his other businesses it's beyond acceptable from a reputational and legal standpoint.
To call a footballer rubbish is subjective and wether or not they are cannot really be proven one way or the other by law. Calling someone a thief or abuser can be.

Yeah and is the current incumbent of Hartlepool United worth that type of punishment? Absolutely not for me. Just football as well.

It’s over & out for me for Pools and posting on the Bunker until change has occurred.

If I was buckled and some raggy fucka on NMW give me a bit of greef.
I would absolutely laff my bollocks off

Wise advice kid.

I am a member of a forum that has had exactly the same kind of problem, and the owner of that decided to stop accepting new members other than by invitation following a nomination from an existing member. A probationary period is also applied, with maximum posts per day and other such restrictions.

In effect, he turned the forum into an online private-members club - as he believed that would give him sufficient protection from libel and slander claims under rules that apply to actual private clubs.

I'm no lawyer so I have no idea if he is correct, and I'm just putting it forward as something that might be of interest to Mr I.

The devil in me suggests that he'd be safer registering it as an online mosque - but that's just silly of me isn't it...

You ask why not go through with the sale. Raj has told us that the reason for the stalling of the sale is because the funds required have not been deposited. So far nobody has come forward to refute that statement, therefore until it is refuted we are obliged to accept that reason. Does anybody know if the funds have been deposited or even what the sum required actually is????
Assumptions, speculation and opinion are all very well but unless they are steeped in, or backed with, factual evidence , they become dangerous and, potentially, very costly. Most of the time Libel doesn't get triggered. If it did there would be thousands of cases per day but when it does and it is against you, you have a problem, Matey.
That is the situation facing us and we have to sort that problem. No amount of well what about this or what about that, although sound argument, is relevant.

if fans were told facts that were true we,d see little or know speculation about them but just discuss what we have been told.

That's no excuse for blatantly making things up, but yes it would help.

Who were the posters mentioned in the letter who actually wrote allegedly libelous comments towards Raj?
Have they been informed by the moderators?

Read this thread from the top.

but is it someone thinking anything and posting it or interpeting a few facts or rumours to fit an agenda they might have. possibly every subject on here and anywhere else is just like that with different opinions on the same facts available to all. feel the higher up a person is they are open to more lies but are the ones quicker to take legal action. if we were talking about fans abuse on line to a lass working in a food/drinks outlet very little would have been said about our actions.

Okay, so apart from a member who only posted once, it is basically Mutley and Mr Snowy, which no doubt a lot of people know who they actually are!

Who knows but at the moment we are faced with threats of legal action, so really more concerned with what is happening not further speculation of what ifs, mights or maybes.

Not necessarily as the posts highlighted were examples, so we don't know if they have others in mind.
People will know who they are yes.
Is your "questionnaire" leading anywhere may I ask??????

Has Elon Musk had a letter?
With being the owner of twitter (x).
He must be shitting his pants.

I'm serious!

And what about the gadge who owns Facebook.

Maybe Elon Musk has a few bob more in his bank account than Mr I and is therefore just a tad less worried about being sued for libel?

Maybe he got anutha letter to let him know if he wants to immulate the USA Wrexham effect.

Would you be OK with that?